The Trump implosion thread!

Quote: kenarman

Where we have a difference of opinion is that I believe that you think the lockdown is going to save a large percentage of the possible deaths. I am not convinced of that and feel that the majority of people who are going to die will be gone under either scenario. If my assumption is correct then a lockdown of any extended period to save relatively few lives is not worth the harm of the lockdown. I would love for you to be right. The public health officials know that the death toll is going to be very large but don't want to panic people.

Do you really think the medical personal can work 12 hr days, not being able to see their families, not get the virus for 6 months without breaking down.

Your opinion is flat out wrong. Not even open for debate. One of the main reasons for the ridiculous death rate in Italy is that the surge overwhelmed the number of ventilators. You had a chance if there was a ventilator when you needed one. Without one you had no chance if at that level of sickness. I can’t tell you how many lives saved in US versus Italy due to flattening the curve, but it is a large enough number that public policy leans that way at the expense of the economic devastation we are seeing.

If you would have told me that I’d only have to work 12 hours a day during last two years of Med School and four years of residency I’d have jumped for joy! I don’t think I broke down.

Back to my malaria point. The answer is we value an American life at a ridiculously high level, and an African life at an extremely low level. At least when it comes to what we want to spend our tax dollars on. I find it amusing that once they make it to our soul, even illegally, we then up the value of their lives exponentially! The same person we would allow to die over there without blinking an eye we will empty the bank for once they have snuck in here.

Quote: SOOPOO

If you would have told me that I’d only have to work 12 hours a day during last two years of Med School and four years of residency I’d have jumped for joy! I don’t think I broke down. .

My old boss called that working a half a day.

Quote: SOOPOO

If you would have told me that I’d only have to work 12 hours a day during last two years of Med School and four years of residency I’d have jumped for joy! I don’t think I broke down.

In BC the medical staff nurses, doctors and front line support staff are not allowed to see their kids or spouses. Some are sleeping at work and some are going home to empty houses if they get enough time to go home. They have to tell family that they can't visit their terminal family members, (whether from Covid or some other cause), the family may get one short visit to say goodbye at end of life if they have enough gear to protect them. Distraught family members are often throwing abuse at the person preventing the visiting.

When you were an intern were you dealing with terminal patients and deaths every day all day? I am surprised that you show little empathy for your fellow medical professionals that are being put in a situation that, for most they, were not prepared for. Hopefully you are right and they will just suck it up and continue without serious consequences to themselves and their patients. To do this for 4, 6 or even 12 months is asking a lot. I expect PTSD will be an issue for many of them.

From your discussions with your friends on the front lines how many are we saving? Any feel of how many people of those lucky enough to get a ventilator we save? How long is the average person tie up a ventilator (or multiple people on one which I hear can be done)? Are you able to give a best guess on these and come up with an estimate of what percent of those in the ICU are being saved? Are we rationing ventilators yet in NYC?

Righties claim I never give Donny credit when he does something good.

Well, I give him credit for attacking KY Rep. Thomas Massie on Twitter over Massie trying to hold up the stimulus bill in the house.

Quote: kenarman

In BC the medical staff nurses, doctors and front line support staff are not allowed to see their kids or spouses. Some are sleeping at work and some are going home to empty houses if they get enough time to go home. They have to tell family that they can't visit their terminal family members, (whether from Covid or some other cause), the family may get one short visit to say goodbye at end of life if they have enough gear to protect them. Distraught family members are often throwing abuse at the person preventing the visiting.

When you were an intern were you dealing with terminal patients and deaths every day all day? I am surprised that you show little empathy for your fellow medical professionals that are being put in a situation that, for most they, were not prepared for. Hopefully you are right and they will just suck it up and continue without serious consequences to themselves and their patients. To do this for 4, 6 or even 12 months is asking a lot. I expect PTSD will be an issue for many of them.

From your discussions with your friends on the front lines how many are we saving? Any feel of how many people of those lucky enough to get a ventilator we save? How long is the average person tie up a ventilator (or multiple people on one which I hear can be done)? Are you able to give a best guess on these and come up with an estimate of what percent of those in the ICU are being saved? Are we rationing ventilators yet in NYC?

I am in contact with my colleagues on the front lines every day. Other than my wife, I’m not visiting any family at all either. All my non wife social interactions are by phone or text. During my career I watched and was involved in hundreds if not thousands of deaths. But nothing like this concentration of deaths. PTSD... there are docs that choose pediatric oncology... I’ve often wondered how they cope. Speaking only for my anesthesiologist colleagues... I do not think there will be long term psychological consequences from this disaster. I do have empathy for the front line colleagues. More for the part that they may get sick and spread it to a loved one. Not for the long and hard hours. No reason to regale you with the 27 consecutive hours I was working on a date I won’t forget... 9/10/2001 leading into 9/11/2001. It was a coincidence and had nothing to do with the attack. We are used to ridiculous hours.

I just asked two colleagues the question you just asked! Too early to guess survival percentage they answer. No ventilator rationing yet. As of today.

Quote: ams288

Righties claim I never give Donny credit when he does something good.

Well, I give him credit for attacking KY Rep. Thomas Massie on Twitter over Massie trying to hold up the stimulus bill in the house.

I also agree with Trump. Massie is known as Mr No becuse he almost always votes no.

Quote: SOOPOO

I am in contact with my colleagues on the front lines every day. Other than my wife, I’m not visiting any family at all either. All my non wife social interactions are by phone or text. During my career I watched and was involved in hundreds if not thousands of deaths. But nothing like this concentration of deaths. PTSD... there are docs that choose pediatric oncology... I’ve often wondered how they cope. Speaking only for my anesthesiologist colleagues... I do not think there will be long term psychological consequences from this disaster. I do have empathy for the front line colleagues. More for the part that they may get sick and spread it to a loved one. Not for the long and hard hours. No reason to regale you with the 27 consecutive hours I was working on a date I won’t forget... 9/10/2001 leading into 9/11/2001. It was a coincidence and had nothing to do with the attack. We are used to ridiculous hours.

I just asked two colleagues the question you just asked! Too early to guess survival percentage they answer. No ventilator rationing yet. As of today.

Thank you for the reply.

Quote:

Just now: Trump says that he told Pence not to call the Governor of Washington, Jay Inslee. "Don't call the woman in Michigan," he just said speaking of the duly elected Governor of Michigan. He says that governors must be nice in order to get his attention.

Yeah, I stand by my prediction that Donny ain’t winning MI in November.

He is vindictive and a poor leader.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/03/27/trump-suggests-personal-grievances-factor-into-his-coronavirus-decisions/

Trump had a signing statement that said he would treat the oversight requirement as advisory rather than mandatory.

So here is a little fantasy scenario for the liberals out there.

Trump, emboldened by the lack of oversight, starts funneling money to people and places prohibited by law.
An investigation is opened.
Pence, in an attempt to shield the president, tries to take the fall and resigns.
The house refuses to confirm his replacement, since the administration is under investigation.
Clear evidence of law violations by or directed by Trump come out.
The senators who voted 96-0 to pass this law that was broken tell Trump that this time they will have no choice but to remove him from office if impeached.
Impeachment trial? Maybe. Maybe he just resigns, but I doubt it.
The end result: President Pelosi.

I would think that the Republicans would want the oversight that they ultimately put into the law and voted for unanimously, to protect Trump from himself and the country from President Pelosi.