Original Sin?

November 24th, 2019 at 9:20:55 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25011
Quote: FrGamble
It is so much easier to pretend I am god and to do whatever I want.


Is that what you think atheists do,
pretend they're god? After all
this time you still don't know what
an atheist is. We don't believe in
a god, inside or outside of us.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
November 24th, 2019 at 9:26:30 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25011
Quote: FrGamble
This is a failure to understand the nature of God


Failure to understand the nature of
something that doesn't exist? I'm
baffled by the nature of unicorns
too..

God creating the universe would
be much easier to sell if you had
just one thing you could prove
god did. But you have nothing,
zero, nada. God has no track
record, he's just a popular myth.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
November 24th, 2019 at 9:37:16 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Evenbob
Is that what you think atheists do,
pretend they're god? After all
this time you still don't know what
an atheist is. We don't believe in
a god, inside or outside of us.


Haven't you said many times that we create our own meaning? You don't believe in God because you have taken His place. You want to make your own rules and do whatever you want. It's an easy life I guess.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
November 24th, 2019 at 9:38:11 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Evenbob


God creating the universe would
be much easier to sell if you had
just one thing you could prove
god did. But you have nothing,
zero, nada.


Christianity
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
November 24th, 2019 at 11:06:46 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25011
Quote: FrGamble
Haven't you said many times that we create our own meaning?


We all create our own reality, even
you. Yours is the Catholic god
reality. Mine is not. Creating your
own reality does not mean you
are god. I must obey the rules
of society just like everybody
else, I can hardly do whatever
I want. That's something resentful
god people say about atheists
because they basically feel
constrained by their religion.

If you gave up god and became
an atheist, you'd see your life
was not that much different.
You can't run red lights at
will or rob balks. You can
ignore laws if you like, at
your peril.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
November 24th, 2019 at 11:10:46 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25011
Quote: FrGamble
Christianity


God didn't create Xtionity, even
Jesus didn't. He believed they
were living in the end times,
that was the main message
of his 3 year ministry. Any
NT scholar will tell you all
the early followers were
end of days people.

Xtionity evolved over hundreds
of years of trial and error, It
wasn't created by god, nothing
is.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
November 24th, 2019 at 11:48:48 PM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 25
Posts: 6227
Quote: FrGamble
Petro, thanks for your thoughtful reply. Disagreement is not a bad thing, it gives us something to talk about in a respectful way and to think through things.

The reason why thinking ahead into the future for eternity makes sense is because it is logically possible. Thinking backwards for eternity is not possible because it is illogical. Think about some examples. If you had a stack of blocks you could keep adding to it forever and it makes sense. But every new block you put on the stack would rest on the one before it and that one depends on the one before that and so on and so on. However, if there are these blocks to rest new ones on there needs to be a foundation somewhere that the first and all the other blocks rest on. Without a foundation or beginning of the blocks there would be nothing to support them and there would be no possibility for any new blocks or even the stack at all. This is what contingency is and it is why Shaw is wrong to ask the simplistic question of what caused God? This is a failure to understand the nature of God and what non-contigent means. I've pointed out to Evenbob a couple of times where Shaw has these philosophical and theological misunderstandings about God but he doesn't really listen to me.

I would be happy to keep talking about this if it still doesn't make sense or you have more good questions.
There are some good lessons here if you are interested in spacetime. https://youtu.be/X5rAGfjPSWE



A good explanation as to why time didn't begin with the big bang.
The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW
November 25th, 2019 at 1:16:27 AM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25011
Quote: petroglyph
There are some good lessons here if you are interested in spacetime. https://youtu.be/X5rAGfjPSWE

A good explanation as to why time didn't begin with the big bang.


FrG won't like this, it trashes the
singularity.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
November 25th, 2019 at 5:59:33 AM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Evenbob
FrG won't like this, it trashes the
singularity.


I don't think it trashes the traditional view of Eienstein that much. He spends the majority of the time talking about how the singularity theory makes sense and then kind of abruptly says it is wrong. If you watch it again compare the common sense approach and understandability of the concepts when he is describing Eienstein's theory to the list of hypothetical and complicated theories that follow. I don't think he explained why the singularity model was wrong, but he was clear it was. Then there were a series of more and more strange ideas that seemed more fantastical then the last one.
Petro, does that video really convince you that time is infinite in the past? He also briefly talked about causality and I like his quote, "the uncomfortable something from nothing moment". Putting aside space time, do you think causality can go infinitely back without a first cause?
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
November 25th, 2019 at 8:53:05 AM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 25
Posts: 6227
Quote: FrGamble
Petro, does that video really convince you that time is infinite in the past? He also briefly talked about causality and I like his quote, "the uncomfortable something from nothing moment". Putting aside space time, do you think causality can go infinitely back without a first cause?
I came to the conclusion that time doesn't "pass" decades before this video. I do like how he puts cool graphics to it.

I think he said "the uncomfortable something from nothing moment" simply so he could continue with this video. Other of their videos delve slightly deeper in to that. But the PBS series on spacetime are trying to explain to viewers new discovery's and concepts in science, they didn't set out for a religious fight. Like Galileo, trying to move forward without stepping on religious toes.
The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW