ICE- Authoritarian or community based?

Quote: SOOPOO

If they fired their weapons inappropriately and are guilty of a crime, they are what is known as ‘criminals’, not ‘scapegoats’. Just helping you out. You need it.

If they fired their weapons illegally they are criminals either way. But, originally the admin was defending them with a bogus story, hence my comment of the wagons will be circled and they will double down on the allegations that Pretti was there brandishing his gun and trying to cause damage, or if they will say the agents acted inappropriately.

For example, if the attack on Pretti was ordered from higher, and the agents are now suddenly cast as making mistakes or acting in malice alone, that is what a scapegoat means.

Quote: Gandler

If they fired their weapons illegally they are criminals either way. But, originally the admin was defending them with a bogus story, hence my comment of the wagons will be circled and they will double down on the allegations that Pretti was there brandishing his gun and trying to cause damage, or if they will say the agents acted inappropriately.

For example, if the attack on Pretti was ordered from higher, and the agents are now suddenly cast as making mistakes or acting in malice alone, that is what a scapegoat means.

I know what a scapegoat is. They are not, and will not be, scapegoats. You are just delusional. You think someone ‘up higher’ instructed the officers to
1. Go find Pretti because he spit on one of them a week earlier
2. Use a half dozen of you officers to take him down
3. Even though he’s no threat, have two of you shoot him dead.

What obviously happened is that someone yelled gun, others misinterpreted it AND overreacted. Even if these officers are ‘bad men’, they still want to go home to their wives and kids. Killing someone while being filmed by 20 people does not accomplish that goal.

No scapegoating here. It’s called assigning blame. Accurately!

This now has become an opportunity for both sides of the aisle.
The Democrats will clearly get some reforms they want. Body cameras. Less (or no?) use of masks.
The Republicans, while agreeing with the Democrats on those two issues, might get the public to at least agree on the concept of here legally versus illegally.

Quote: SOOPOO

I know what a scapegoat is. They are not, and will not be, scapegoats. You are just delusional. You think someone ‘up higher’ instructed the officers to
1. Go find Pretti because he spit on one of them a week earlier
2. Use a half dozen of you officers to take him down
3. Even though he’s no threat, have two of you shoot him dead.

What obviously happened is that someone yelled gun, others misinterpreted it AND overreacted. Even if these officers are ‘bad men’, they still want to go home to their wives and kids. Killing someone while being filmed by 20 people does not accomplish that goal.

No scapegoating here. It’s called assigning blame. Accurately!

This now has become an opportunity for both sides of the aisle.
The Democrats will clearly get some reforms they want. Body cameras. Less (or no?) use of masks.
The Republicans, while agreeing with the Democrats on those two issues, might get the public to at least agree on the concept of here legally versus illegally.

This is like the generic crooked cop trick from the 70s-the early 2000s for cops that were secretly working for organized crime or just their own agenda. It doesn't work anymore with cameras everywhere.

But, basically police hit squads would disarm a subject, act panicked and shout "gun gun gun," shot them, and then put the gun back on them. "He was pulling his gun."

Like I said, I am not 100% that is what happened here, but it's looking more likely than less in my opinion.

Quote: SOOPOO

I’m not disagreeing with you. My point is about loser Lemon, not the Trump administration.

But I will say this. You haven’t seen the crowds attacking/threatening/interfering with criminal arrests recently? If I was sent to arrest your docile 98 year old grandmother I’d be nervous today.

Don Lemon got EXACTLY what he was craving.

Absolutely Don Lemon wanted to be arrested for just reporting but not punished
Bondi doesn't want to arrest anybody civilly
She has no interest in following the law
She wants to punish
She ain't waiting for judges to determine punishment
She is going to have her people punish those She hates
That's the bottom line
She could called Lemons lawyer and had him turn himself in
No way she is doing that
She wants to punish
That's why she had her people wait till 1130pm
She wanted to arrest him with over 2 dozen agents late at nite because she wanted to punish lemon
That's why they pushed the woman next to Pretti down
They had no interest in legally arresting her civilly
They were all in on punishing her with physical force
That's why Good got killed
DHS was gonna yank her using physical force and she knew it
She didn't want to be punished physically and tried to get away
If you are stopped for speeding
A cop is not gonna immediately yank you out of your car physically
This is exactly why Bondi prosecuted James and Comey
It was crystal clear to her they were innocent. Justice dept lawyers already determined that
She didn't care because she is so full of hate
She wanted to mess up their lives in any way possible so she charged them
She is totally into punishment
Why not let those here illegally settle their affairs and sell their belongings in a civil way
Because Bondi wants to punish

Quote: terapined1

Absolutely Don Lemon wanted to be arrested for just reporting but not punished
Bondi doesn't want to arrest anybody civilly
She has no interest in following the law
She wants to punish
She ain't waiting for judges to determine punishment
She is going to have her people punish those She hates
That's the bottom line
She could called Lemons lawyer and had him turn himself in
No way she is doing that
She wants to punish
That's why she had her people wait till 1130pm
She wanted to arrest him with over 2 dozen agents late at nite because she wanted to punish lemon
That's why they pushed the woman next to Pretti down
They had no interest in legally arresting her civilly
They were all in on punishing her with physical force
That's why Good got killed
DHS was gonna yank her using physical force and she knew it
She didn't want to be punished physically and tried to get away
If you are stopped for speeding
A cop is not gonna immediately yank you out of your car physically
This is exactly why Bondi prosecuted James and Comey
It was crystal clear to her they were innocent. Justice dept lawyers already determined that
She didn't care because she is so full of hate
She wanted to mess up their lives in any way possible so she charged them
She is totally into punishment
Why not let those here illegally settle their affairs and sell their belongings in a civil way
Because Bondi wants to punish

They can settle their affairs in a civil way. But the vast majority don’t. The number that sell their stuff and buy a ticket to the country of their citizenship is a tiny fraction of those trying to stay here illegally. And you know that. It’s only once they are caught that they are complaining about the way that they were caught.
I’m disagreeing with you on Good. She was being egged on by her wife, and chose to risk the lives of the arresting officers. You just don’t ignore the orders of law enforcement. The wife even blamed herself.

Quote: SOOPOO

They can settle their affairs in a civil way. But the vast majority don’t. The number that sell their stuff and buy a ticket to the country of their citizenship is a tiny fraction of those trying to stay here illegally. And you know that. It’s only once they are caught that they are complaining about the way that they were caught.
I’m disagreeing with you on Good. She was being egged on by her wife, and chose to risk the lives of the arresting officers. You just don’t ignore the orders of law enforcement. The wife even blamed herself.

WTF
1.9 million voluntarily deported in 2025
WTF is wrong with you. That's not a tiny fraction
Not even close
Try MAJORITY
600k forced deportations
Why do you want to see these people punished
Do you enjoy watching these people be punished???????
Do you enjoy the Trump administration punishing people instead of doing things in a civil manner

Are you OK with DHS using physical force to punish her???????????
You are OK with the govt breaking the law
If you get stopped in your car for breaking the law. Say speeding
You expect the govt to yank you out of your car physically

Quote: terapined1

Why do you want to see these people punished?

I only want to see illegal immigrants rounded up and SENT BACK HOME to where they belong.

They don't belong in the USA, no matter if they married a citizen, have anchor children and/or are CEO's of a taco factory in Bumfuck, Utah.

We should have even tougher laws: but the issue isn't the laws on the books, it is the ongoing enforcement of them, i.e. their politicization.

Quote: terapined1

WTF
1.9 million voluntarily deported in 2025
WTF is wrong with you. That's not a tiny fraction
Not even close
Try MAJORITY
600k forced deportations
Why do you want to see these people punished
Do you enjoy watching these people be punished???????
Do you enjoy the Trump administration punishing people instead of doing things in a civil manner

Are you OK with DHS using physical force to punish her???????????
You are OK with the govt breaking the law
If you get stopped in your car for breaking the law. Say speeding
You expect the govt to yank you out of your car physically

If I do not follow the commands of the officer, I would expect them to use some degree of reasonable force. If I refuse to turn off my engine I’d expect them to yank me out of the car. If I am reaching for my glove compartment without permission all bets are off. But as opposed to Good, none of these things would ever happen to me, because I would follow the officer’s instructions.

I was unaware The Trump Administration was so successful in their effort to have illegal aliens self deport! Stunning success, frankly. I was also unaware we dangled a carrot of $3k for each self-deportee! Too bad the 600k you refer to required law enforcement to ferret them out!

Are you praising the Trump administration for the record number of self deportations?

Quote: SOOPOO

If I do not follow the commands of the officer, I would expect them to use some degree of reasonable force. If I refuse to turn off my engine I’d expect them to yank me out of the car. If I am reaching for my glove compartment without permission all bets are off. But as opposed to Good, none of these things would ever happen to me, because I would follow the officer’s instructions.

I was unaware The Trump Administration was so successful in their effort to have illegal aliens self deport! Stunning success, frankly. I was also unaware we dangled a carrot of $3k for each self-deportee! Too bad the 600k you refer to required law enforcement to ferret them out!

Are you praising the Trump administration for the record number of self deportations?

WTF
No way they were not going to get physical with her
Dont you watch the videos!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They are all over the internet
DHS says to car over and over in video after video "If you keep following us, we will yank you out of your car"
Translation
We know following is legal but we still will punish you illegally
Why cant DHS be civil????????
Why do they have to punish???????
Because they know its against the law so they wear masks
They punish because protestors are OK with being arrested civilly
Protestors are just like any other human being on the planet
They hate to be physically punished
DHS knows physical punishment is illegal and due to hate, will illegally punish those they hate

All administrations have voluntary deportations
Only the Trump admin is into punishment

Quote: terapined1

All administrations have voluntary deportations
Only the Trump admin is into punishment

Not quite the whole story. My AI assistant told me, as an example, in 2024, Biden’s last year in office, COMBINED voluntary and involuntary deportations of illegal aliens was around 800k. Maybe A THIRD of those during Trump’s first year. But you won’t recognize that AMAZING SUCCESS story, will you?

Do I love the way ICE operates? Nope. Once the investigation is over and the two shooters of Pretti are tried, I’ll most likely agree with their conviction. Do those two bad actors mean that the other ICE agents who helped round up the other 600k are not doing their jobs legally? NO! Find specific instances of abuse. Prosecute the abusers. You want body cameras? You’ll get them. You want the ICErs unmasked. It’ll be done. But let’s get those here ILLEGALLY out of here!