ROEvember is Coming

Quote: Tanko

It is not humane. No creature deserves to die that way.

It is an innocent living creature. We have laws requiring serial killers, cattle, pigs, poultry and other animals to be slaughtered humanly, but not fetuses.

How would you suggest that we kill the fetus humanely?

Quote: DRich

How would you suggest that we kill the fetus humanely?

He would suggest forcing the woman to carry the unwanted fetus to term against her will.

Quote: DRich

How would you suggest that we kill the fetus humanely?

Perhaps that bit of humanity should come from those who support the killing of the fetus.

Wait...they can't acknowledge that the being created can feel pain because they actually have to acknowledge openly that it is a living being and that it feels pain when killed.

I am pragmatic about abortion and I know it will continue to be a losing issue for Republicans as long as they try to shorten the period is allowed to happen. Until every State has settled law that is not easily challenged or changed (unlike Roe, which was a flawed decision as acknowledged even by people in favor of the decision) and people in the US Congress stop trying to get involved, it will be an election issue. Republicans have work to do to face that and make the rest of their message better. They are not doing that.

I just do not get the right on abortion, happy to block all surgical and pharmaceutical options, in the name of being pro-life, but support shooting people you disagree with, death penalty, etc.... It is just so strange to me that actual killing is cheered, but medical procedures must be stopped at all costs. And, this is becoming such a normative position, I think it is the largest right-wing position (it is certainly the issue that the Evangelicals care the most about, so if we extrapolate their views on the rest of the right.)

I think I have met (that I know of) one person who was pro-life in the proper principled way (they were against all abortion, against all killing, vegan of course, against almost any kind of violence except the most extreme scenarios.) Of course, I regard this as a silly world view, but it is at least consistent (and in my view the only way to be actually "pro-life" and be taken seriously.) But, this dude is not the norm (I do not even know if he is still like that, it has been years.)

Well, it it’s god thing, god for some reason saw fit to have the wildebeest taken down by pack animals and torn apart and eaten alive. I don’t recall any pain at all having my shoulder and arm broke at the same time.. Not until a minute later or so. It seems likely the body has a mechanism like endorphins that kicks in those initial moments of severe trauma.

Now I can remember lesser forms of injury when they were happening. Do we assume death by violent trauma will just be 10 times worse, when really a blocking mechanism of some sort kicks in before death and it’s only if you survive violent injury that you start to feel the extent of the injuries?

Quote: Gandler

I just do not get the right on abortion, happy to block all surgical and pharmaceutical options, in the name of being pro-life, but support shooting people you disagree with, death penalty, etc.... It is just so strange to me that actual killing is cheered, but medical procedures must be stopped at all costs. And, this is becoming such a normative position, I think it is the largest right-wing position (it is certainly the issue that the Evangelicals care the most about, so if we extrapolate their views on the rest of the right.)

I think I have met (that I know of) one person who was pro-life in the proper principled way (they were against all abortion, against all killing, vegan of course, against almost any kind of violence except the most extreme scenarios.) Of course, I regard this as a silly world view, but it is at least consistent (and in my view the only way to be actually "pro-life" and be taken seriously.) But, this dude is not the norm (I do not even know if he is still like that, it has been years.)

The lefty position is quite consistent. It is fine to kill a baby in the womb and it fine for Hamas to kill babies a few weeks older.

Quote: kenarman

The lefty position is quite consistent. It is fine to kill a baby in the womb and it fine for Hamas to kill babies a few weeks older.

Yes, people on the left are certainly the ones cheering Hamas on.... (Hamas is a right-wing organization by the way.)

Quote: kenarman

The lefty position is quite consistent. It is fine to kill a baby in the womb and it fine for Hamas to kill babies a few weeks older.

Is being consistent a bad thing?

Quote: Gandler

I just do not get the right on abortion, happy to block all surgical and pharmaceutical options, in the name of being pro-life,...

That is the extreme view, and very few people support that.

Most Recent Harvard/Harris Poll:

'73% of Americans oppose abortion after fifteen weeks'

"10% Support Democrat Position of Abortion on Demand up to Birth"

72% of Republicans support National protections at no later than 15 weeks

Includes 75% of women, compared to 69% of men.
Includes 70% of Independents and 60% of Democrats

Only five nations do not have a federal ban on gestational limits, and allow abortions up to to birth. China, North Korea, Vietnam, Canada and the US.

Quote: Tanko

That is the extreme view, and very few people support that.

Most Recent Harvard/Harris Poll:

'73% of Americans oppose abortion after fifteen weeks'

"10% Support Democrat Position of Abortion on Demand up to Birth"

72% of Republicans support National protections at no later than 15 weeks

Includes 75% of women, compared to 69% of men.
Includes 70% of Independents and 60% of Democrats

Only five nations do not have a federal ban on gestational limits, and allow abortions up to to birth. China, North Korea, Vietnam, Canada and the US.

Seems like RonC has realized that the longer the right focuses on abortion, the longer they’re going to imperil their chances at winning elections.

Whereas Tanko is pretending the right’s position on abortion isn’t actually their position. The gaslighting clearly didn’t work in Ohio. And it isn’t going to work anytime in the immediate future.