The Coronavirus thread

Quote: Gandler

If masks don't work why is it a critical piece of PPE for healthcare workers (even before COVID-19). Of course masks work (if you are wearing them properly).
Now, you don't need a mask alone in a car (that can actually be dangerous), but in a packed subway, yes masks are a necessity.

Police are paid to keep people safe and enforce rules, they were doing their job.

You seem seriously supportive of some kind of dictatorial government control powers. But consider this, you may not like it if you end up on the wrong side of control. What happens if all the Christian right get the power and go house to house in some kind of rage against you? That isn't why all those pilgrims to pioneers worked and sacrificed so much for. They fought for freedom. I had a lot more freedom in my life, than you will have in yours. And it was great. I'm so glad to have lived when I did. Free love, all that. Rock and roll, etc.

In Calif., it is legal, if a person knows that they are HIV positive, to have unprotected sex with others and not tell them. If the rest of us, can't even mandate that someone who knows they have HIV/AIDS can have unprotected sex with others, how can you suggest that the gov. has the authority or the right to tell others to wear a mask? That's ridiculous, both are, and I'm not suggesting anything about you.

There is no limit to the amount of freedoms, those with mad lust for authority will take from us. Remember feudalism. That is what you are suggesting, that the power of gov. be absolute. Just like the draft, it's ok to draft poor kids but not the elite. As long as we have a volunteer military, the freedoms listed aren't for everybody. So many people have sacrificed so much for our freedom, I am surprised at your suggestions of giving those freedoms away being a sworn vet?

Read some Jack Kerouac or something.

Quote:

For the most part my attitude did prevail in 1776. Most of the crazy protests (Boston Tea Party) were frowned upon by the mainstream. The U.S. wanted to part ways legally and after that failed moved to military action. The idea that the American Revolution was some anarchist dream is far from the truth. It was very structured, organized and followed principles. It was actually a pretty clean revolution as far as revolutions go....

The Boston tea party was waged because of 3% taxation. Go back further than 1776, people wanted to get out from under Royalty and you can see how brutal and abusive GB has been around the world. It's taken millions of lives for people to not have to live in slavery, don't give that back.

Pretty sure there are more than a few dystopian novels about government using manufactured emergencies to control the population.

But we've got to make reasonable decisions. It's much easier to demonstrate that shutting down a business might be unreasonable. But wearing a mask? Is that really worth a fight?

Choose the right battles. Keeping 6 feet from each other shouldn't be an issue to go to war over either. Having no way to pay your bills? Now that's an issue.

And so on and so on.

Quote: Gandler

If masks don't work why is it a critical piece of PPE for healthcare workers (even before COVID-19). Of course masks work (if you are wearing them properly).

Because health care workers are in an extreme situation. The grocery store is not a hospital. The mask rules are about making a subset of the population think the government is "doing something."

Quote: rxwine

Pretty sure there are more than a few dystopian novels about government using manufactured emergencies to control the population.

But we've got to make reasonable decisions. It's much easier to demonstrate that shutting down a business might be unreasonable. But wearing a mask? Is that really worth a fight?

Choose the right battles. Keeping 6 feet from each other shouldn't be an issue to go to war over either. Having no way to pay your bills? Now that's an issue.

And so on and so on.

It is the "boiling frog" thing. Even if that analogy is scientifically not so true the principle behind it is. You accept masks just fine. OK, what is the next thing? And the next? This is how free societies become unfree.

Quote: Face

So far 100% of WNY front line retailers refuse my .gov issued pistol permit as valid ID, even though it has all my particulars including photo on it.

As that seems not to count, I'll be American #1. Haven't had ID in months.

You don't have a driver's license?

Don't you occasionally go to Canada?

And although a"WNY front line retailer" (whatever that is?) did not accept your ID as an ID, that doesn't mean you don't have an ID. It means the retailer needs to be educated, right?

Quote: petroglyph

Did you show them your gun?

That doesn't have my name on it either lol

Quote: SOOPOO

You don't have a driver's license?

Nope. Haven't had one in months, and won't for months more.

Quote: SOOP

Don't you occasionally go to Canada?

I'll be there in ~2hrs. No customs on the water.

Quote: SOOP

And although a"WNY front line retailer" (whatever that is?)...

A clerk. Cashier. Shopkeep. You know.

It's as Carlin says - "America doesn't want smart citizens, she just wants em smart enough to run the machines." My pistol permit even has my job title on it, in addition to DOB, address, name and pic. It's a wholly valid state issued ID and I've never once been able to use it for anything but buying pistol caliber ammunition. Dunno if you've looked around lately, but there's a lot of stupid people about.

My CCW solves the guns and ammo problem. I don't drink nor visit the dispensary. DMV is all online. My banker is my next door neighbor of 35yrs. Pharmacy is verbal confirmation. 5-0 can look me up via the info I supply them. DEC uses my old paperwork. Hockey I'm in the system 20+yrs. Court already has my particulars. No one gives a care at USPS (lost my fed badge, too). And of course, I don't need it to vote.

I'd wager I could go all of 2020 and then some with no sweat, but I'm no thief.

Quote: petroglyph

You seem seriously supportive of some kind of dictatorial government control powers. But consider this, you may not like it if you end up on the wrong side of control. What happens if all the Christian right get the power and go house to house in some kind of rage against you? That isn't why all those pilgrims to pioneers worked and sacrificed so much for. They fought for freedom. I had a lot more freedom in my life, than you will have in yours. And it was great. I'm so glad to have lived when I did. Free love, all that. Rock and roll, etc.

In Calif., it is legal, if a person knows that they are HIV positive, to have unprotected sex with others and not tell them. If the rest of us, can't even mandate that someone who knows they have HIV/AIDS can have unprotected sex with others, how can you suggest that the gov. has the authority or the right to tell others to wear a mask? That's ridiculous, both are, and I'm not suggesting anything about you.

There is no limit to the amount of freedoms, those with mad lust for authority will take from us. Remember feudalism. That is what you are suggesting, that the power of gov. be absolute. Just like the draft, it's ok to draft poor kids but not the elite. As long as we have a volunteer military, the freedoms listed aren't for everybody. So many people have sacrificed so much for our freedom, I am surprised at your suggestions of giving those freedoms away being a sworn vet?

Read some Jack Kerouac or something.

The Boston tea party was waged because of 3% taxation. Go back further than 1776, people wanted to get out from under Royalty and you can see how brutal and abusive GB has been around the world. It's taken millions of lives for people to not have to live in slavery, don't give that back.

Ok there is a lot to unpack and respond to here, but I will do my best.

I do not support a dictatorship government, I support our Constitutional Republic. I despise the current President and many other elected officials. But, they are still elected and must be respected. I am just principled enough that I point out it is necessary to even respect opposition when it comes to laws and executive orders. I may not like Trump or my Governor , but I still respect them and follow their orders.

The Christian Right have been in power for much of history. We live in a secular country with a constitution that keeps them in check and limits their influence on religious based laws. I love America because of the Constitution, and its secular history. I actually have three books that I keep with me on my Desk: The Full Constitution (which also includes many writings by the founding fathers), the Founding Fathers were great heroes of mine because of their intellect and forward thinking (the other two books are The Art of War and Arabian Nights).

I think California is wrong and is in the minority as far as allowing HIV people to have sex without notifying their partner. I don't know much about California law. But, I don't agree with that. I also don't live there (and never would despite being born there, for a number of reasons). I also don't know the masks requirements in California so I am not at a place to make a judgement on the hypocrisy.

I am not suggesting feudalism. I am a liberal and favor equality and social programs to help the poor. I do however, believe that we need to respect authorities when they act according to their policies. I am sorry, but being inconvenienced for a few months is not giving away freedoms. There are emergency powers for a reason: major wars, pandemics, and natural disasters.


This is opening a can of worms, but as to you last point, GB and Spain did a lot of good by colonizing. They brought technology and new systems to places in the world that have never seen such things. Of course there were horrors to colonization. But, as far as global progress, it was an overall good thing (yes I know not another popular view)…. Yes, colonization came with racism and theocracy in some cases. But, is also spread progress. I actually enjoy reading the journals (more so of the Spanish conquistadors) to see their perspective as they venture into new lands and interact with new peoples.

Quote: Face

That doesn't have my name on it either lol




Nope. Haven't had one in months, and won't for months more.



I'll be there in ~2hrs. No customs on the water.



A clerk. Cashier. Shopkeep. You know.

It's as Carlin says - "America doesn't want smart citizens, she just wants em smart enough to run the machines." My pistol permit even has my job title on it, in addition to DOB, address, name and pic. It's a wholly valid state issued ID and I've never once been able to use it for anything but buying pistol caliber ammunition. Dunno if you've looked around lately, but there's a lot of stupid people about.

My CCW solves the guns and ammo problem. I don't drink nor visit the dispensary. DMV is all online. My banker is my next door neighbor of 35yrs. Pharmacy is verbal confirmation. 5-0 can look me up via the info I supply them. DEC uses my old paperwork. Hockey I'm in the system 20+yrs. Court already has my particulars. No one gives a care at USPS (lost my fed badge, too). And of course, I don't need it to vote.

I'd wager I could go all of 2020 and then some with no sweat, but I'm no thief.

Its not my business, but out of curiosity, how do you work for USPS without a valid driving license? I thought that was a requirement?
Or do you just work in the office?

Quote: Gandler

Its not my business, but out of curiosity, how do you work for USPS without a valid driving license? I thought that was a requirement?
Or do you just work in the office?

I'm a licensed driver and had a physical license at the time of my employ. I simply lost it and haven't replaced it

Quote: Face

I'm a licensed driver and had a physical license at the time of my employ. I simply lost it and haven't replaced it

Aren't you concerned of that being a huge problem if you get pulled over? This is how so many bad stops on "COPS" start.