Simple question?

Quote: FrGamble

That is evidence is it not that there is something more to it than some scam.

Again... for instance.

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Bloodletting was based on an ancient system of medicine in which blood and other bodily fluids were regarded as "humors" that had to remain in proper balance to maintain health. It is claimed to have been the most common medical practice performed by surgeons from antiquity until the late 19th century, a span of almost 2,000 years.[1] In Europe the practice continued to be relatively common until the end of the 18th century.[2] The practice has now been abandoned by modern style medicine for all except a few very specific conditions.[3

2000 years. Amazing how long it can take for the greater population to finally abandon something they think has been working all along.

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Today it is well established that bloodletting is not effective for most diseases. Indeed, it is mostly harmful, since it can weaken the patient and facilitate infections. Bloodletting is used today in the treatment of a few diseases, including hemochromatosis and polycythemia; however, these rare diseases were unknown and undiagnosable before the advent of scientific medicine.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloodletting

Quote: FrGamble

It is pretty amazing how awesome the world is

It's amazing what random chance and
evolution did. Seriously, if this world
is looked over by some god, it's a
truly frightening and pathetic place.
This must be one of the worst gods
in the universe, his babies die by
getting bit by a mosquito. Understandable
for a random world, unforgivable for one
run by a so-called loving god.

I know you know I'm right, but you would
never admit. Self deception is a powerful
force.

Quote: FrGamble

Your past experiences, current situations, stubbornness of mind, secular brainwashing, .

Where do you see secular brainwashing, exactly.
There are no atheist seminaries or atheist colleges
or even atheist organizations. There are no atheist
brainwashers that I can see anywhere.

Quote: FrGamble

Is there a lack of evidence that contingent things need a cause?

Is there evidence that the energy making up the universe is contingent?

Surely there is, or you wouldn't be so sanguine about it. So what is it?

Quote:

What possible lack of evidence could you possibly be speaking of?

Your position that there is some kind of god has zero evidence on its side. It has far less evidence than, say astrology. For the latter, we know there are constellations which form the Zodiac.

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To speak the truth is looked at as a condescension and meanness. It is true that no other religion has the truth of the historical person of Jesus Christ and yet mentioning this truth looks to you like condescension.

Here's a truth: there are tens of thousands of gods which people have believed in and worshiped throughout the years. You believe in none but one or two or three of them. Therefore you're almost as fully an atheist as I am, but you refuse to commit to what you know to be true for some reason.

BTW, you cannot disprove the existence of any of the myriad gods you don't believe in. If you give me the patently false line that it was all Jehovah doing partial revelations, I'll remind you of each deity which required human sacrifices.

Quote: FrGamble

The faith in Christ began with a few dozen huddled in a small upper room in fear. After they saw the risen Lord they exploded unto the scene and spread the Good News

That's the myth, the reality is much different.
But like you say, we've been down that road
many times. I still wonder why they never
wrote about all those Jewish saints that came
flying out of their tombs after Jesus woke up
from his coma. Maybe they smelled bad and
nobody knew who they were. Maybe it never
happened, that would be my guess.

This is a pretty neat 10min. Nothing here
you don't know probably, but he makes
good points about brain evolution. And
religion is never mentioned once.

Quote: Evenbob

It's amazing what random chance and
evolution did. Seriously, if this world
is looked over by some god, it's a
truly frightening and pathetic place.
This must be one of the worst gods
in the universe, his babies die by
getting bit by a mosquito. Understandable
for a random world, unforgivable for one
run by a so-called loving god.

I know you know I'm right, but you would
never admit. Self deception is a powerful
force.

I know that you are very wrong and clearly not really thinking clearly about this issue. First of all do you really think a random world based on chance would even have us, life, or mosquitos at all? Seriously think about the chances we are talking about here; it is 1 in a number so big if I did nothing but type it for 100 years it would still not adequately reflect the chances that you or I or the universe as it exists now would exist. A random by chance world would also not even make you question about fairness or goodness relevant. We wouldn't have a concept of what is right or fair or how a good God would or should create the universe. If all we knew was what we have experienced then we couldn't make judgments about it. We have the gift of reason and a moral compass that calls out to us that a baby dying by a mosquito bit is wrong! We reject the concept that it is just random chance and we don't accept it. We rail and pound against the sickening idea and false notion that there is not order and purpose and fairness and justice and goodness and love and the ultimate correction of the things that gets us so upset about the good but obviously imperfect world in which we live. We see in ourselves this same goodness but imperfection.
Secondly, you fail to see the role we all have to play in the plight of this baby. Why is it that in this world there are millions of people who cannot even afford mosquito nets? Think of the injustice of that. Think about how so many of these people are denied simple preventative care and adequate medical treatment, not to mention adequate and safe housing and clean water! Why is that? Greed, selfishness, and societal sins. Before you go blaming God make sure you have cleared yourself of any wrongdoing!

Quote: Nareed

Is there evidence that the energy making up the universe is contingent?

So do you think energy has created itself? Or do you think energy is a necessary being that holds the reason for its existence in itself? Do you think energy created the very laws that it is governed by? Basically, do you think energy is divine in some sense?

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Your position that there is some kind of god has zero evidence on its side.

How do you go on ignoring logic and reason when it is right in front of you?

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Here's a truth: there are tens of thousands of gods which people have believed in and worshiped throughout the years. You believe in none but one or two or three of them. Therefore you're almost as fully an atheist as I am, but you refuse to commit to what you know to be true for some reason.

Today there are much, much fewer religions that exist and the overwhelming majority of all religions claim to believe in the same God. Any religion that acknowledges the truth of God is far closer to truth than an atheist who against all evidence and against logic and reason itself claims that for sure there is no God.

Quote:

BTW, you cannot disprove the existence of any of the myriad gods you don't believe in.

Sure you can using history, philosophy, anthropology, and science.

Quote:

If you give me the patently false line that it was all Jehovah doing partial revelations, I'll remind you of each deity which required human sacrifices.

And I'll remind you that none of the deities have any followers today and that they were obviously always wrong about what their so called deity* was requiring of them.

*probably safer to use the word demon here.

Quote: Evenbob

That's the myth, the reality is much different.

The reality is exactly as I have presented it. Do you doubt that Christianity began as a small movement of disciples huddled in fear after the crucifixion? The Resurrection is the ONLY explanation for what happened to these early followers of Jesus and their tireless mission to spread the Good News of Jesus. If you have another explanation you have never given it, because there is none that makes sense.

Quote:

Maybe it never
happened, that would be my guess.

Yeah, probably not. It was only in one Gospel and is an example of obvious hyperbole that you can find in other ancient near east writings of the time. You can also look at the writings of the Church Fathers who clearly took it as an example of the ultimate results of the Resurrection that we would one day experience and not actual events.

Quote: FrGamble

Before you go blaming God !

There is no god to blame, that's my point. Nice
long apologist paragraph, though. I knew you
were going to twist it around to our sins killing
kids with mosquitoes, you can't help it. Your job
is to blame man and his sins for everything
possible. It's how the Church stays in the
forgiving sins business. I'm sure you don't don't
even hear yourself doing it. I'm grateful every
day I didn't have to grow up around Christian
negativity being shoved in my face every day,