Gay Marriage

Quote: boymimbo

A&E, Mozilla, and HGTV didn't have to dump those people.

Thank you very much. That was my entire point. Hypocritical gays and their supporters sanctimoniously defended the rights of private businesses to turn people away..........that is, until it conflicted with their own interests. (This concession makes the rest of your post irrelevant)

Quote: boymimbo

That's quite a bit different than saying "I won't serve you because it's a gay marriage". I am absolutely positive that if that is the only thing (two brides as decorations) is the top of the cake, the couple would just go to the local Walmart and buy two male / female figures to put on top of the cake and even give hat to the decorator to throw on top of the cake. Hopefully the Walmart employee won't put the connection together that the two figures are for a gay wedding and refuse to sell it to them.

At that point the decorator is free to say, "I don't use decorations I do not carry myself." The WMT employee is just ringing out a product anyone can buy. The decorator is being forced to provide a product they do not want to sell.

Quote:

I think you made my point, but it goes beyond that. In New Mexico, a wedding photographer must provide its services to all, including same-sex couples. Now of course, according to the lawsuit, they must provide the service, but are within their first amendment rights to say that they oppose same sex marrriage. So, if I'm the provider, I can say that I don't like to provide the service to same-sex couples but must, and if that doesn't push away the service, so be it.

And this is a shame. The way it works is you call a photographer and negotiate a service. The photographer should be free to say, "sorry, I do not care to do business with you, please find someone else."

Now if this was said to a normal person with an ounce of class they would just find another photographer. A low-class person throwing a hissy-fit will sue. And rights are lost because of their hissy fit. Sad times we live in.

By your logic, a black photographer should be allowed to be sued for refusing to photograph a KKK meeting, right?

Quote: AZDuffman

Now if this was said to a normal person with an ounce of class they would just find another photographer. A low-class person throwing a hissy-fit will sue. And rights are lost because of their hissy fit. Sad times we live in.

+1

That's an excellent way to put it. Instead of simply moving on, these low class people did everything they could to "punish" the evil bakery.

Quote: AZDuffman

By your logic, a black photographer should be allowed to be sued for refusing to photograph a KKK meeting, right?

+1

Gays and their hypocritical supporters never like to address points like this. Just like they avoided talking about this story:

Gay Hairstylist: No haircut for you because you oppose gay marriage!

Quote: AZDuffman

At that point the decorator is free to say, "I don't use decorations I do not carry myself." The WMT employee is just ringing out a product anyone can buy. The decorator is being forced to provide a product they do not want to sell.



And this is a shame. The way it works is you call a photographer and negotiate a service. The photographer should be free to say, "sorry, I do not care to do business with you, please find someone else."

Now if this was said to a normal person with an ounce of class they would just find another photographer. A low-class person throwing a hissy-fit will sue. And rights are lost because of their hissy fit. Sad times we live in.

By your logic, a black photographer should be allowed to be sued for refusing to photograph a KKK meeting, right?

Not my logic. I didn't say I supported the law. At some point, one's personal / religious freedom should trump rights. But a business that caters to the "public" cannot discriminate based on pretty much anything. However, in my opinion, I think there needs to be a borderline where personal services are excepted. The wedding cake wouldn't qualify for that exception (they're really selling a good/service where they won't be present) whereas the photographer might.

If i had issues with gay marriage, I would make it clear that my personal preference was not to do the wedding and recommend someone else's services. If they wanted me to do the service anyway, I probably would go for spite and do a crappy job and give them a big discount for doing such a crappy job provided I was confident enough that a negative internet rating wouldn't hurt me overall.

However, I am in to run a business and make money. If I was the only available photographer or the only photographer around for miles, I would do the service despite my personal preferences as I am providing a service to the PUBLIC.

In this connected world, one bad rating ruins a reputation. Whenever I go to an unknown restaurant or hotel (and I do this alot), the Yelp / Tripadvisor / Google ratings go a long way. One or two negative reviews will turn me away.

Quote: boymimbo

Not my logic. I didn't say I supported the law. At some point, one's personal / religious freedom should trump rights. But a business that caters to the "public" cannot discriminate based on pretty much anything. However, in my opinion, I think there needs to be a borderline where personal services are excepted. The wedding cake wouldn't qualify for that exception (they're really selling a good/service where they won't be present) whereas the photographer might.

See, I don't consider it that because each cake is custom. Back to my McDonald's example, you can't go into a McDonald's and demand the Big Mac be made with fish because you do not eat beef. They will say, "sorry, this is a product we do not choose to make." Yes, all the ingredients are in the store, but they choose not to make it. The photographer no doubt, that is bidding on a job. Anyone who has been in this type of business knows well that you often see a job and choose not to bid for various reasons.

Quote:

In this connected world, one bad rating ruins a reputation. Whenever I go to an unknown restaurant or hotel (and I do this alot), the Yelp / Tripadvisor / Google ratings go a long way. One or two negative reviews will turn me away.

This is exactly why we do not need a law. If the bakery get a review saying, "they would not make a cake for my gay marriage" then some people will stay away. OTOH some, like myself, might try them out to support them, just like I and millions did for Chick-Fil-A. Still supposed to be a free country.

Quote: AZDuffman

Yhis is exactly why we do not need a law. If the bakery get a review saying, "they would not make a cake for my gay marriage" then some people will stay away. OTOH some, like myself, might try them out to support them, just like I and millions did for Chick-Fil-A. Still supposed to be a free country.

Yep, and then, how would you feel when the same retailer turned you away for looking funny? It's a free country. 50 years ago, blacks in Alabama probably had to travel hundreds of miles just to have the privilege to sit on the front of the bus. One bus driver could have bucked the trend and told the passenger "sit whereever you want!" but back then, that employee would have been fired for exercising their belief.

Quote: boymimbo

Yep, and then, how would you feel when the same retailer turned you away for looking funny? It's a free country. 50 years ago, blacks in Alabama probably had to travel hundreds of miles just to have the privilege to sit on the front of the bus. One bus driver could have bucked the trend and told the passenger "sit whereever you want!" but back then, that employee would have been fired for exercising their belief.

Well, first things first. I've been turned away for how I look. Bar didn't want college kids in there. We went in at lunch time to have a drink and some food. Owner said, "Lunch is over." We simply left and took our business to our regular bar. He sold out the next year.

Now, if the bakery has cookies for sale and I say, "21 dozen, please," and they say, "no," well that is a problem because they offered an item for sale at a fixed price. I offered that price. They cannot legally refuse for the most part. However, if they have sugar cookies and I say, "1 dozen chocolate chip" I can't sue because they say, "we don't carry chocolate chip."

Well, all they are saying is, "we don't carry gay wedding cakes." The gay couple needs to man up and find someone that does want their business.

This November will be the perfect time to prove all the delusional people wrong who keeping saying that the GOP needs to support gay marriage (and abortion) in order to win elections.

In California, Neel Kashkari is the Republican gubernatorial candidate, and he supports both abortion & gay marriage. But regardless of what delusional libs say, I bet this guy will still get crushed this November, thus disproving the ridiculous argument that moderate candidates will be the GOP's saviors.

What about Ahnold?

Quote: boymimbo

What about Ahnold?

He was a world famous movie star. If he were your average politician, he would have gotten crushed. Just like what's going to happen to this Kashkari loser.

Also, just for the record, I never claimed that it's impossible for such a candidate to win a single race. I only took issue with those who said that running pro-abortion/pro-gay marriage candidates is the way to regain power because that's not true at all.