Juneteenth

Quote: missedhervee

Beign a serf or an indentured servant, as most Europeans once were, was tantamount to slavery.

I researched a bit on serfdom because it is one of those weird subjects that grabbed my attention. While serfdom was just a notch better than slavery, serf conditions varied and the further east you went the worse it was for them, with Russia treating them about the worst. Technically, even the personal possessions of a serf were property of their lord. But serfs were not supposed to be sold like slaves unless the land was sold.

The company towns I mentioned were virtual serfdom. You could not own land, you did not get paid in actual money. You were bonded to the area. It was just debt and no other possibilities not law.

Quote: missedhervee

Being a serf or an indentured servant, as most Europeans once were, was tantamount to slavery.

I fully agree, but luckily neither is legal in the U.S. anymore either. I'm sure you could probably find some ME and Asian countries that have modern indentured servitude though.

Quote: AZDuffman

I think you need to learn how company towns worked. It was just an easier form of slavery.

It was not slavery.

You guys who say every job you don't like is "like slavery," just undermine actually slavery.

I actually live in a former company town as of a couple months ago. Company towns have pros and cons. There were certainly dark aspects (especially in certain companies,) but even the worst ones were not slavery.

Quote: Gandler

It was not slavery.

You guys who say every job you don't like is "like slavery," just undermine actually slavery.

I actually live in a former company town as of a couple months ago. Company towns have pros and cons. There were certainly dark aspects (especially in certain companies,) but even the worst ones were not slavery.

Well, when you lived there did you have to rent from the company? Did you have to shop in the company store at inflated prices? Did you get paid in cash or company script?

You are right in that it was not like slavery in some ways. If a slave got sick he was not evicted from the town.

Quote: AZDuffman

Well, when you lived there did you have to rent from the company? Did you have to shop in the company store at inflated prices? Did you get paid in cash or company script?

You are right in that it was not like slavery in some ways. If a slave got sick he was not evicted from the town.

They chose to live and work there. However, good or bad their rent and payment options are is ultimately irrelevant in terms of defining slavery, they chose that arrangement, and consented to it.

Yes some company town based jobs sucked, and some people were probably afraid to leave because they know it well and worked there for years. Some people are afraid to leave modern jobs because it is all they know and they feel desperate. It does not make either slavery.


The idea that you are now implying company towns are worse than slavery because you can be evicted from company towns is absurd. Like beyond absurd, this argument is another level of delusional equivocation. The fact that you could get evicted is one more piece of evidence it was not slavery.



Look there are a lot of jobs and employers I despise. Many that I view as borderline abusive scams. It is not slavery if you can walk away anytime that you want with no physical consequences (and I say physical because sure you may lose some money or benefits, or maybe even be sued, none of that matters...)

Quote: Gandler

They chose to live and work there. However, good or bad their rent and payment options are is ultimately irrelevant in terms of defining slavery, they chose that arrangement, and consented to it.

Yes some company town based jobs sucked, and some people were probably afraid to leave because they know it well and worked there for years. Some people are afraid to leave modern jobs because it is all they know and they feel desperate. It does not make either slavery.


The idea that you are now implying company towns are worse than slavery because you can be evicted from company towns is absurd. Like beyond absurd, this argument is another level of delusional equivocation. The fact that you could get evicted is one more piece of evidence it was not slavery.



Look there are a lot of jobs and employers I despise. Many that I view as borderline abusive scams. It is not slavery if you can walk away anytime that you want with no physical consequences (and I say physical because sure you may lose some money or benefits, or maybe even be sued, none of that matters...)

You seriously do not get it.

Quote: fleaswatter

A few Juneteenth memes

More racism. You argue my best when you argue my point. Carry on!

Quote: fleaswatter

A few Juneteenth memes

Kwanzaa deserves the contempt, but Juneteenth?... of course it's humor. Humor on a subject that Geno would not find funny. Must really hate the one about Republicans making Juneteenth possible LOL . So Geno adds to the humor. Those were good, clever.

For Juneteenth, it's partly a reminder of how old I am. I keep picturing the following scene in grade school of my day. It's unlikely because although Juneteenth was obviously around, we were not told it was a holiday in school! Probably not even in Texas would this happen.

The Teacher hears everyone talking about Juneteenth. She then goes on to insist on the correction 'June Nineteenth'. When some brave soul says "but people say Juneteenth" this gets shot down as following the example of ignorant people [or worse, except in MA, Geno]. The girls in the class observe the correction but the boys keep getting in trouble for saying Juneteenth.

Today the teachers everywhere no doubt tell the kids all about Juneteenth and don't miss a beat using that word.

Quote: AZDuffman

You seriously do not get it.

I think I get it pretty well. Some company towns suck. Some sucked a lot and were miserable. It is still empirically not slavery.

Clarification: No company towns inside the U.S. post civil war were. I am sure you can cite some towns in some other countries in the late 1800s-nid 1900s that technically had slaves. But, speaking in terms of U.S. towns, no.

I am sure many had rough and dangerous lives. I am sure it was miserable. I am also sure it was not slavery. I am also sure in most cases it was better than not having a job...