JD Vance and "couch coitus"

Quote: ams288

People of the opposite gender in the wrong bathroom. Isn’t this like your biggest nightmare?

I've said it's not a big deal with me, but I do have sympathy for women who oppose it. Worry about rape is of course a real thing, not that I expect you to ever have that cross your mind

You're thinking of my opposition of normally chromosomed *young people* being social-media-influenced and school-influenced and worst of all medical-organization-influenced [and carved up] for gender dysphoria. Of course you'll next claim I am against adults deciding to do transitions, which I am not.

Quote: odiousgambit

I've said it's not a big deal with me, but I do have sympathy for women who oppose it. Worry about rape is of course a real thing, not that I expect you to ever have that cross your mind

You're thinking of my opposition of normally chromosomed *young people* being social-media-influenced and school-influenced and worst of all medical-organization-influenced [and carved up] for gender dysphoria. Of course you'll next claim I am against adults deciding to do transitions, which I am not.

I'm not sure a rapist would be deterred by the gender sign on a bathroom. I will defer to women on the issue of rape and abortion though.

I'm actually in agreement with you on the on the transgender issue. I don't agree with suppressing puberty or gender surgery before the age of 18.

Quote: DaveeyD

I'm actually in agreement with you on the on the transgender issue. I don't agree with suppressing puberty or gender surgery before the age of 18.

I guess I’m the only radical on the board who says if a doctor, parents and child all are in favor and a reasonable waiting period has passed, then it’s okay by me.

I figure if parents are allowed to take their kids into a dangerous mind bending cult Jim Jones/ David Koresch type community without any consultation at all, who am I to stop someone from a more carefully managed process?

That doesn’t mean there isn’t obvious malpractice/ or mispractice in this area. But if I use that criteria I can apply it to all kinds of procedures.

*note the child should be able to comprehend and communicate effectively or I wouldn’t be in favor of it occurring. But that can be different ages for different children.

You can’t eliminate risk with a high risk pediatric heart surgery either and that may even cause death. So there’s always risk and will always be failure.

Quote: rxwine

I guess I’m the only radical on the board who says if a doctor, parents and child all are in favor and a reasonable waiting period has passed, then it’s okay by me.

you the only one? that would surprise me

I'd like to know the percentage of those kids making this decision who were not influenced by social media or activists that influence school programs.

Quote: odiousgambit

you the only one? that would surprise me

I'd like to know the percentage of those kids making this decision who were not influenced by social media or activists that influence school programs.

I don't know, but I certainly complain about religious communities doing outreach to other people's children to try to convert. Shall we end it all from happening?

Quote: rxwine

I guess I’m the only radical on the board who says if a doctor, parents and child all are in favor and a reasonable waiting period has passed, then it’s okay by me.

I figure if parents are allowed to take their kids into a dangerous mind bending cult Jim Jones/ David Koresch type community without any consultation at all, who am I to stop someone from a more carefully managed process?

That doesn’t mean there isn’t obvious malpractice/ or mispractice in this area. But if I use that criteria I can apply it to all kinds of procedures.

*note the child should be able to comprehend and communicate effectively or I wouldn’t be in favor of it occurring. But that can be different ages for different children.

You can’t eliminate risk with a high risk pediatric heart surgery either and that may even cause death. So there’s always risk and will always be failure.

I think it's a slippery slope, after 18 I say do whatever you want. My body my choice right? Societal pressures, peer pressures, media all come into play in shaping a child. Lots of bat-shit crazy parents out there, on the left and the right. Nurture or Nature? The child is the least responsible one in this scenario.

Quote: DaveeyD

I think it's a slippery slope, after 18 I say do whatever you want. My body my choice right? Societal pressures, peer pressures, media all come into play in shaping a child. Lots of bat-shit crazy parents out there, on the left and the right. Nurture or Nature? The child is the least responsible one in this scenario.

I'm doing my best not to decide for the individual situation as it can differ from one person to another.. Another saying is "walk a mile in my shoes."

My suggestion is, "what if your parents made you dress as a girl in school growing up?" (I believe you're male, though not sure if you said) This is how I perceive the situation for trans kids. Not feeling in the right body, wearing the wrong clothes. How would you deal with it?

I'm definitely not saying anything one decides is the absolutely right decision.

Quote: DaveeyD

I think it's a slippery slope, after 18 I say do whatever you want. My body my choice right? Societal pressures, peer pressures, media all come into play in shaping a child. Lots of bat-shit crazy parents out there, on the left and the right. Nurture or Nature? The child is the least responsible one in this scenario.

I agree with this, I am very against people getting irreversible surgeries (that are not medically necessary,) before 18. Mixed feelings about hormones, but surgeries are a bridge too far. Too many rash decisions are made before 18 (with too much influence from people other than yourself.)

Quote: DaveeyD

I think it's a slippery slope, after 18 I say do whatever you want. My body my choice right? Societal pressures, peer pressures, media all come into play in shaping a child. Lots of bat-shit crazy parents out there, on the left and the right. Nurture or Nature? The child is the least responsible one in this scenario.

You all make it sound like teenagers and preteens are making whimsical decisions on the same level as changing hairstyles. Friendly reminder that it is physicians prescribing these non-surgical treatments, after evaluating and diagnosing illness. It is physicians who are performing these procedures, after evaluating and diagnosing illness. Peer pressure has nothing to do with it. Societal pressure as nothing to do wit it. These are medical patients, under the care of medical doctors, receiving medical treatment.

Quote: GenoDRPh

You all make it sound like teenagers and preteens are making whimsical decisions on the same level as changing hairstyles. Friendly reminder that it is physicians prescribing these non-surgical treatments, after evaluating and diagnosing illness. It is physicians who are performing these procedures, after evaluating and diagnosing illness. Peer pressure has nothing to do with it. Societal pressure as nothing to do wit it. These are medical patients, under the care of medical doctors, receiving medical treatment.

I can agree with that, if, after a mental/medical evaluation an actual doctor decides to prescribe some form of puberty blockers. Although the long term effects of puberty blockers on muscle growth, etc is not known. From everything I've read, the puberty blockers can be reversed, in most cases.

Still I don't like surgery until after 18, then do whatever you like. If it were my child, I'd allow them to dress or act any way they want, and at 18 if they want to go full tilt, I'll drive them.