Tulsi Gabbard

December 6th, 2019 at 7:45:06 AM permalink
kenarman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 11
Posts: 2191
Quote: rxwine
Why do you want us to give full speech rights about our elections to people who are adversaries like the Russians? Or China, or Iran, or N. korea? None of them can vote here.


Freedom of speech is giving everyone the right to speak even those you disagree with. Who knows, they might actually be right sometimes
"but if you make yourselves sheep, the wolves will eat you." Benjamin Franklin
December 6th, 2019 at 7:57:09 AM permalink
terapined
Member since: Aug 6, 2014
Threads: 52
Posts: 6467
Quote: kenarman
Freedom of speech is giving everyone the right to speak even those you disagree with. Who knows, they might actually be right sometimes

I agree
Stand on a street corner and say whatever you want. Start your own ISP and create a web page.
but
This freedom does not extend to private web sites or private ISP
If banned from twitter or any other private platform or ISP, too bad.
Sometimes we live no particular way but our own - Grateful Dead "Eyes of the World"
December 6th, 2019 at 8:21:15 AM permalink
kenarman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 11
Posts: 2191
Quote: terapined
I agree
Stand on a street corner and say whatever you want. Start your own ISP and create a web page.
but
This freedom does not extend to private web sites or private ISP
If banned from twitter or any other private platform or ISP, too bad.


I don't follow your logic TP. Why are the social media sites different from a street corner, newspaper, book, blog ..?
"but if you make yourselves sheep, the wolves will eat you." Benjamin Franklin
December 6th, 2019 at 8:25:14 AM permalink
terapined
Member since: Aug 6, 2014
Threads: 52
Posts: 6467
Quote: kenarman
I don't follow your logic TP. Why are the social media sites different from a street corner, newspaper, book, blog ..?


Nobody owns a street corner. Yell all you want
Social media sites are similar to Diversity Tomorrow
The Wizard has a right to nuke anybody from this site regardless of freedom of speech rights
Nuked member Beethoven has absolutely no freedom of speech rights on this web site
Wizards house, Wizards rules
Social media sites have the same rights as the Wizard
Sometimes we live no particular way but our own - Grateful Dead "Eyes of the World"
December 6th, 2019 at 8:50:10 AM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 144
Posts: 10256
Quote: kenarman
Freedom of speech is giving everyone the right to speak even those you disagree with. Who knows, they might actually be right sometimes


They can, they just can't participate in our elections through buying political ads. And we aren't blocked from going to look at what other countries have to say.
Trump says his supporters are dumber than a sack of rocks
December 6th, 2019 at 9:01:26 AM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 3347
Newspapers are the same way.

The organization of the newspaper decides what is published, not the government, and not individuals writing to the newspaper to get published in the 'letters to the editor' section, for example.

Radio stations, also. The station owners control the content, show producers and call screeners control who gets on the air in a call in show, and they have a mute and disconnect buttons that they can use at their own discretion.

The freedom of speech part of the first amendment is about self-publishing in an open forum, and about what a government can't do to restrict you.

So, a public street corner is different. There, you mostly have the right of assembly, and mostly have the right of free speech.

A blog - you are self-publishing, but you are buying the service to do so from someone else. It is up to the agreement between the user and the provider, usually disclosed during account sign-up, what each party can and can not do.

You can write and distribute a book or a newspaper yourself. Such as on a street corner. If you use a publisher, though, again you are giving up some control based on your agreement with the publisher.

So, basically, Facebook and Twitter and the like are not public open forums, they are private entities in which people have entered into a terms of service agreement.

These issues are also currently in the courts, mostly at the ISP level, to determine if an ISP is a "common carrier" (basically an "open forum" for the purposes of this discussion) and if they are allowed to regulate the content that they carry.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/fredcampbell/2016/07/22/courts-net-neutrality-opinion-wrong-about-first-amendment/#7a6516c67758

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/09/isps-dont-have-1st-amendment-right-to-edit-internet-fcc-tells-court/

Twitter and Facebook and the like would have to get categorized as common carriers in order to NOT to be able to control the content distributed on their platforms.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan
December 6th, 2019 at 10:42:07 AM permalink
Shrek
Member since: Aug 13, 2019
Threads: 5
Posts: 1269
Quote: kenarman
I don't follow your logic TP
Neither does anybody else.
I guess it's because he doesn't use any logic. 😂😂
December 6th, 2019 at 5:52:01 PM permalink
kenarman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 11
Posts: 2191
Quote: terapined
Nobody owns a street corner. Yell all you want
Social media sites are similar to Diversity Tomorrow
The Wizard has a right to nuke anybody from this site regardless of freedom of speech rights
Nuked member Beethoven has absolutely no freedom of speech rights on this web site
Wizards house, Wizards rules
Social media sites have the same rights as the Wizard


But what is actually being pushed by the lefties is for the government to regulate the sites. They are pushing Mark Zukerberg to censor Facebook and he is refusing. So I take it you support Zukerberg's position of not censoring any possibly political positions on Facebook.
"but if you make yourselves sheep, the wolves will eat you." Benjamin Franklin
December 6th, 2019 at 6:02:24 PM permalink
terapined
Member since: Aug 6, 2014
Threads: 52
Posts: 6467
Quote: kenarman
But what is actually being pushed by the lefties is for the government to regulate the sites. They are pushing Mark Zukerberg to censor Facebook and he is refusing. So I take it you support Zukerberg's position of not censoring any possibly political positions on Facebook.

I'm a big Sacha Baron Cohen fan
The guy is hilarious
And
I totally agree with him regarding FB
Sometimes we live no particular way but our own - Grateful Dead "Eyes of the World"
December 6th, 2019 at 6:47:45 PM permalink
kenarman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 11
Posts: 2191
Quote: terapined
I'm a big Sacha Baron Cohen fan
The guy is hilarious
And
I totally agree with him regarding FB


None of this answers my original post about who does the censorship. SBC says to fact check the ad. We already know from the small group on this forum that we can't agree on what the "facts" are on almost anything. Both the lefties and the righties on the forum when presented with something they don't agree with immediately claim the source being quoted is biased. I don't know how we are ever going to dig ourselves out of this mess short of war.
"but if you make yourselves sheep, the wolves will eat you." Benjamin Franklin