Two Gods or One

Quote: Dalex64

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_the_eye

I saw a doc on this, NatGeo probably. A whole episode on the evolution of the eye. Completely fascinating.

Quote: Face

I saw a doc on this, NatGeo probably. A whole episode on the evolution of the eye. Completely fascinating.

Yeah, the eye is amazing, and the way eyes have evolved is doubly so.

Creationists say half an eye isn't useful... but it is. So the adaption stays and grows and spreads. They eye just didn't happen randomly. But it wasn't planned either ;)

I find so much of the scientific discussion evolution fascinating, nature is so amazing.

However, some of what is being said is an example of how wretched and poor science is at doing philosophy. Here is a great article that would very much be worth your time to read. I think you will find it very interesting and a great example of taking what science teaches us and using that evidence to think about the bigger questions as to what it all means.

Wonder and Love and why scientists neglect God

Quote: FrGamble

However, some of what is being said is an example of how wretched and poor science is at doing philosophy.

It's not the job of scientists to "do" philosophy.

Oh, and if by philosophy you mean "the hand maiden of religion," then that's no one's job.

Quote: TheCesspit

Creationists say half an eye isn't useful... but it is.

I wonder what they'd say about half a mind. Some of them make do on less than that ;)

Quote: FrGamble

However, some of what is being said is an example of how wretched and poor science is at doing philosophy. Here is a great article that would very much be worth your time to read. I think you will find it very interesting and a great example of taking what science teaches us and using that evidence to think about the bigger questions as to what it all means.

Your philosopher likewise did a poor job at philosophizing ;)

It's human-centric. And the only way we are at the center is because we put ourselves there.

The dog doesn't know? Says who? How do you know it is not the dog who has it all figured out? You ever seen a homeless dog? One nearing a heart attack due to crushing debt? One who stresses about low rain and crop failure? I ain't never. Kick your dog into the street with no food, water, shelter, or medical care. Then do the same with yourself. See who lasts longer =)

Humans also do not get a full picture. Even literally, your brain rejects and discards a huge majority or the things you see. Just like the frog and the bug, we are made to recognize certain things. Sure, we can stop to admire a newly bloomed daffodil, as I just did when I happened upon a patch deep in the woods. But there are untold millions of things mine own eyes blind me from every day.

What does a shark know that I don't, they who can sense the electrical impulses from the muscles of other fish. What does a hound know that I don't, who can make a picture based off a smell a month old. What does a bass know that I don't, that can identify everything around it through no more than a line of nerves stretched along its body. What must the world look like to a cave shrimp that has no eyes? Or a bee that can see UV? Or a turkey than can hear your heart beating before you even know it's there?

We are inundated by information. Sound, noise, chemical, radiation, thermal... and almost none of it do we sense. We are, for all our magnificence, blind to 99% of existence.

But I'm sure we're the best ;)

Quote: Face

But I'm sure we're the best ;)

We've done pretty well at natural selection's reproducibility criteria. No other large mammal, unassisted, comes close to the numbers we can put up.

We've proven beneficial to a large range of animal and vegetable species we depend on, again by the same criteria. Maybe livestock doesn't have much of a life, but there are plenty of them! The flip side is we tend to hurt similarly useful plants and animals when we can't or won't domesticate them.

Among these animals dogs and cats stand out. While they were domesticated for use (as aides in hunting and controlling vermin respectively), and still are used to a large extent, we mostly have them around out of love. I'm sure it helps we rarely ever saw them as food.

We've also been a boon for our symbiotic bacteria, as well as pathogens, parasites and vermin. In particular rats are one of the great beneficiaries of human success.

I personally think you can't really have two species equal at the top because the other one is direct completion and confers nothing if you can't mate. WE can barely interact as it is within our own species without significant conflict.

Quote: rxwine

I personally think you can't really have two species equal at the top because the other one is direct completion and confers nothing if you can't mate. WE can barely interact as it is within our own species without significant conflict.

Why consider there to be a 'top'?

Quote: Face

Your philosopher likewise did a poor job at philosophizing ;)
)

Articles like that are written by god
people to show that we're somehow
better than all the creatures around
us and more special and more important.
In fact, we're so extra special, with our
swollen egos and our extraordinary
narcissism, there must be some god
that looks over us day and night.

The truth is, we're no better or worse
or more important to the universe than
any other creature on the planet. How
could we be, we all evolved from the
same origins. When you realize that it's
a humbling experience. Where's the
humility in any god worshiping religion,
they're all about me me me. Where do
I fit it in, what does god think of me,
does god have a plan for me me me?