Did you ever notice?

Quote: FrGamble

"I did say that." -Jesus

No, he really didn't. He didn't say most
of the things attributed to him.

Quote: boymimbo

For Christians, everyone has sin and everyone is sinful, without exception.

Not in the same way. LGBT people are seen as sinful not for what they do or think, but for what they are. it's like pronouncing all left-handed people sinful, which BTW Christians have done.

Quote: rxwine

I think modern religion is the last stronghold of magic and sorcery being the unknown source of things.

You should browse skepticism blogs and learn different.

It's in good company with homeopathy, astrology, numerology, phrenology, and any and all beliefs in paranormal phenomena and any and all superstitions.

Quote: FrGamble

This is not to say that supernatural causes are unverifiable which would be as good as calling them useless. What I am trying to point out is that you need a different tool to discover them that is not lab equipment. Namely you need to use your noggin or good old reason.

When you separate reasoned thought from empirical observation at best you get opinion, and at worst fantasy, nonsense or wishful thinking. I'm astonished anyone would suggest this as a serious tool for such an important question.

I'm still awaiting definitive evidence that the one true God Athena is not real.

Quote: Nareed

Not in the same way. LGBT people are seen as sinful not for what they do or think, but for what they are. it's like pronouncing all left-handed people sinful, which BTW Christians have done.

Everyone but Jesus is sinful.

Quote: Evenbob

No, he really didn't. He didn't say most
of the things attributed to him.

Really?!? Is this all coming from an internet search you did on the Jesus Seminar? Keep reading other scholars and theologians. Look into how things were transmitted in the ancient world and study the meaning of the Inspiration of Scripture. That will give you a more balanced and accurate picture of the historical Jesus and His sayings.

Quote: FrGamble

"I did say that." -Jesus

Jesus didn't write down a word. Different people report him saying different things, including when he's described as being alone.

If you think you, or anyone else, can know to a certainty what Jesus said, you show a real passion for hubris.

Lest it seems I'm being too hard on the Jesus, the same problem occurs with Socrates. he never wrote anything down. Plato wrote all that Socrates is alleged to have said.

What Plato wrote for himself and what he claimed Socrates wrote, are different enough to suppose they are from different sources. But I have no doubt some of Plato's biases are included in Socrates' works.

Actually many historians worked on working out whether Jesus can be attributed to have said something or done something. The source is the number of eyewitness accounts, not only in the bible, but in other accounts as well.

[Edit]There are many criticisms of the Jesus Seminars which include biased examiners and a poor methodology. However, it is reasonable to assume that because the books were written well after Jesus' death that some embellishments were made. Luke is assumed to be the most accurate.[/Edit]

The same problem is true with all ancient history. No one was there, and there were no reliable reproductive implements so if a library got destroyed or decayed the information with it went to ruin.

The Bible and its contents were kept however through all of the years which is why we can say that Jesus did exist and was a special person of interest (to say the least).