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Quote: stinkingliberal

Actually, no employer would pay an employee exactly what that employee's worth, because then there would be no profit in the action. In fact, doing so would entail a loss, because of tax and other liabilities. The employer would be better off not employing that person at all.

In order to survive, the worker must sell his labor at a discount from its true worth--the economic benefit that his employer derives from it. The only reason the system works at all is that economies of scale make that worth greater for the employer than it would be for the self-employed worker doing the same tasks.

MODERATOR. Who is this impostor ????

Quote: AZDuffman

Unless a union is restraining trade in labor of course.

Well the union just becomes part of the mix. A union can retard wages too.

Quote: rxwine

If that was true, there would always be a direct correlation between a companies profits and employee wages.

There is.

Quote: stinkingliberal

Actually, no employer would pay an employee exactly what that employee's worth, because then there would be no profit in the action. In fact, doing so would entail a loss, because of tax and other liabilities. The employer would be better off not employing that person at all.

In order to survive, the worker must sell his labor at a discount from its true worth--the economic benefit that his employer derives from it. The only reason the system works at all is that economies of scale make that worth greater for the employer than it would be for the self-employed worker doing the same tasks.

Wrong. By definition the cost of labor is it's true worth. Most individuals think they're worth a lot more than they really are.

Quote: pew

There is.

You think the kids at your local McDonalds' all get a bonus when their local store has a good month?

Quote: pew

Wrong. By definition the cost of labor is it's true worth. Most individuals think they're worth a lot more than they really are.

Wrong. Don't confuse cost and worth. And don't misspell "its."

The worth of a good with no intrinsic value is indeed its market price/cost. However, a worker's production, or a cheeseburger, or a pencil, or a 2017 Lexus all have some intrinsic value, so their price/cost is not solely a function of the market.

Quote: rxwine

You think the kids at your local McDonalds' all get a bonus when their local store has a good month?

I still remember being informed by my boss at McDonald's that due to my outstanding performance, I was getting a raise from $1.65 to $1.70 an hour. At current prices, that was about four french fries an hour.

Maybe today's McWorkers get extra pickles when the store does well.

Quote: pew

There is.

No, not a direct correlation. Increased company profits are NOT always demonstrably accompanied by an increase in employee wages. If a direct correlation existed, wages would change every time profits changed (up or down).

There is a very weak positive correlation between profits and wages in that a profitable firm will survive longer than an unprofitable firm and thus, be more likely to increase its employees' wages. But that's all.

Henry Ford paid wages that made headlines around the world. He had to. Men who had been craftsmen did not like being turned into assembly line drones.

The phone company hired female operators... they did not want to. Men would not stick at their boring 'number please' work, boys would not do it ... only females would accept such boring dehumanizing work. So that is what the company hired.

There was a PBS program on the old Anchor Hocking company and its neighborhood that grew up with work ethics, high paying jobs and steady unionized income. One of the kids who grew up there stayed and is now the police chief. He commented that when the only job in town is a minimum wage job at a fast food joint with not the slightest chance of advancement the workers turn to alcohol, drugs and wife beating. If you can't make a living wage then you have to dull the pain somehow, most use oxycontin or heroin.

Capitalism had been fine for the company and the community, then Icahn came along and GreenMailed the company into paying him a premium to go away and the company also sold off assets that made it less attractive to Icahn. So some distant company bought Anchor Hocking and the new executives did not live in the town or drink in the local bars, their wives did not do fund drives for local hospitals and roads, etc. Soon the absentee executives were doing leveraged buyouts wherein debt wa created to buy the Anchor Hocking assets but instead of paying that debt from profits the new owners sold off assets and paid the debt off leaving a non-competitive shell of a company. All of this is capitalism but of a different nature than the benevolent capitalism of the past.

Binion left; the Evil Empire arrived. Same story all over the place.

I had a friend who said if he had a business he would only hired women. Especially over 40. Married or single, they marry the job.\First grievance I had was from IOC International Operator Center in Lakewood, CO. Women 1st line supervisors had suspended a girl for being chronically almost tardy.

That's right. She would sit out in hallway, reading a book. at 20 second to 8, she would close the book and then walk to her position in time to plug in at 1 or 2 seconds till 8 am.

Was in Houston Texas, a dozen or so operators crossed picket line, cause AT&T loved them. Next year they had to move to Dallas to chase their pensions. 1 year later, they all had a job, in New York City. I think 1 went, maybe.