Climate Change -- conspiracy theory or is it time we all drive a Prius?

Quote: Dalex64

You are about to hear the argument that indirectly observed temperatures can not be accurate.

If you hear a gunshot and feel the hot blast of air passing by your ear, do you tell yourself those are indirect observations and therefore you fail to duck?

Quote: Dalex64

You are about to hear the argument that indirectly observed temperatures can not be accurate.

Because they are not accurate. At best they will come within a few degrees of accurate. At the same time, said few degrees is the same few degrees we are saying temps may change by. GIGO.

Quote: AZDuffman

This is similar to saying the stock market has "never gone up like this in history!" with less than 1 minute of data.

Tiime to throw out all your political beliefs like how socialism can't work and other prononcements of certainty you've often made..

Quote: JimRockford

Since you expressed it correctly here, I assume you realize your original statement was off by several orders of magnitude, but I knew what you meant.

Decimal place accuracy aside, I have to disagree with your main point that it's the climate science adherents that aren't taking a long enough view.
When we emerged from the ice age about 11,000 years ago global temperatures rose about 5 deg F over a 7000 year period. Global temperature is now up 1.4 deg F in less than 200 years. The rapid temperature increase coincides with a steep increase in CO2 concentration that is now much higher than it's been in the last 800,000 years. (It probably hasn't been this high in at least 5,000,000 years) Our species has never experienced anything like this.

Looks like a nice regular cycle for the last 400K years and that we are not quite at the next peak yet according to your graph. How is this proving your point?

Quote: rxwine

Tiime to throw out all your political beliefs like how socialism can't work .

Socialism can work if it's done by
programmed robots. With people
that have hopes and dreams and
drives to succeed, it has failed
every time and will always fail.

You must be rewarded for the
work you do in proportion to
how much effort you put in,
or you will have no incentive.
I'm not going to work my ass
off so Joe Blow down the road
can live as good a life as I do.

so·cial·ism
noun
a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

Quote: AZDuffman

We do not know accurate temp readings for over 150 years ago. We never will as nobody measured and kept records. CO2 is just one variable. Solar activity is another, and you are again talking 4.5 billion years, this time with accurate measurement for maybe 80. This is similar to saying the stock market has "never gone up like this in history!" with less than 1 minute of data.

I will keep beating it, GW believers are listening to alarmists who fly private jets and live in mansions. Your leaders are not taking it serious, why are you?

Estimates of Temperatures in the distant past is uncertain compared with modern measurements. Scientists have worked hard to reduce the signal to noise ratio by combining many different sources. However it is clear that, after emerging from the most recent ice age , temperature was stable until the early 19th century. When it began to rise steeply. Solar activity does not explain it. The physics of greenhouse gases has been well understood since the 1800s. CO2 concentration over the millennia is much more certain due to preserved air in ice core samples.

my point is that climate science is not ignoring the age of the earth. 4.5 billion years is a long time and the climate has had some massive swings accompanied by dramatic changes plant and animal life. I'm not a climate scientist I have a job and a life so I connot adequately assess all of the research, but Jacking up CO2 concentration to a level not known for a million years seems like a risky experiment.

I don't pay ANY attention to politicians or celebrities on matters of science.

Quote: JimRockford

I don't pay ANY attention to politicians or celebrities on matters of science.

Then do not listen to them when it comes to GW. Ever notice the "solution" is always more taxes and less freedom? GW is a scam the pols have latched on to. World has been "ending in 20 years" for 30+ years now.

Quote: AZDuffman

Ever notice the "solution" is always more taxes and less freedom?

Yes. It is always that way.
People eating "mixed foods" (ie, foreign foods).
Ukrainians, Lithuanians with hard liquor, Italians with wine, Germans with beer.
Syndicalists, Socialists.
Facillitated Communication
DayCare Molestation
Space-Alien Invasions
Cocaine crazed Negro brains endangering White women.
Maryjane
Women voting
Horseless Carriages

Doesn't mean you should utterly reject all science though.

Quote: kenarman

Quote: JimRockford

Since you expressed it correctly here, I assume you realize your original statement was off by several orders of magnitude, but I knew what you meant.

Decimal place accuracy aside, I have to disagree with your main point that it's the climate science adherents that aren't taking a long enough view.
When we emerged from the ice age about 11,000 years ago global temperatures rose about 5 deg F over a 7000 year period. Global temperature is now up 1.4 deg F in less than 200 years. The rapid temperature increase coincides with a steep increase in CO2 concentration that is now much higher than it's been in the last 800,000 years. (It probably hasn't been this high in at least 5,000,000 years) Our species has never experienced anything like this.

Looks like a nice regular cycle for the last 400K years and that we are not quite at the next peak yet according to your graph. How is this proving your point?

1. Temperature change correlates to CO2 concentration change over a really long timeframe.
2. CO2 concentration has increased very rapidly to a crazy high level viewed in a really long timeframe.
3. Climate scientists consider changes that have occurred over a really long timeframe.

This graph doesn't have enough granularity to show the warm up of the last 150 years.

Quote: Fleastiff

Yes. It is always that way.
People eating "mixed foods" (ie, foreign foods).
Ukrainians, Lithuanians with hard liquor, Italians with wine, Germans with beer.
Syndicalists, Socialists.
Facillitated Communication
DayCare Molestation
Space-Alien Invasions
Cocaine crazed Negro brains endangering White women.
Maryjane
Women voting
Horseless Carriages

Doesn't mean you should utterly reject all science though.

I don’t reject it all. Just the junk.