The "Four Corners" States

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January 7th, 2019 at 12:29:46 PM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 25
Posts: 6227
Quote: AZDuffman
Quote: Wizard
I think they moved the borders a little to make the marker correct. Have a look at this map. You can see the border between Utah and Colorado bends to the east a bit to cut through the marker. The border between New Mexico and Arizona doesn't seem to do that. That suggests to me the line of longitude between UT and CO is further west, by several feet, than that between NM and AZ.


All surveys out there are probably off by a bit. Consider this, a full degree is about 69 miles. A minute (1/60 of a degree for the non-landmen out there) is 1.15 miles, a second is .02 miles. I won't even get in to magnetic declination changing over the decades, but I will say I find little survey errors all the time in areas of <300 acres. Over thousands of miles, I don't even want to imagine. Given how middle of nowhere that area is even today, just say close is good enough in this case as "exact" is near impossible.
I thought they were using navigational seconds, minutes, and degrees?

When navigating, there are sixty seconds in a minute, a minute equals a mile, sixty miles in a degree of Latitude . 6000[76]ft. in a nautical mile?

"Nautical mile - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nautical_mile
For distance measurement on land, see mile. For the US unit based on the equator, see geographical mile. A nautical mile is a unit of measurement used in both air and marine navigation, and for the ...
Statute mile‎: ‎≈1.15078 Unit system‎: ‎Non-SI unit
1 M, NM, or nmi in‎: ‎is equal to Unit of‎: ‎Length"
The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW
January 7th, 2019 at 12:36:36 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: petroglyph
I thought they were using navigational seconds, minutes, and degrees?

When navigating, there are sixty seconds in a minute, a minute equals a mile, sixty miles in a degree of Latitude . 6000[76]ft. in a nautical mile?


They could be, I am just using simple measurements. I read degree bearings as part of my job. I plot them into plots. I do not do the surveying. For all I know the Four Corners was measured with perches, links, rods, and roods.
The President is a fink.
January 7th, 2019 at 1:59:43 PM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 25
Posts: 6227
Quote: AZDuffman
Quote: petroglyph
I thought they were using navigational seconds, minutes, and degrees?

When navigating, there are sixty seconds in a minute, a minute equals a mile, sixty miles in a degree of Latitude . 6000[76]ft. in a nautical mile?


They could be, I am just using simple measurements. I read degree bearings as part of my job. I plot them into plots. I do not do the surveying. For all I know the Four Corners was measured with perches, links, rods, and roods.
I don't know either. They may have used a chain for all I am aware?

I thought they knew where the actual location was when we went and stood in 4 states at once? It was later in the local paper that it was claimed it wasn't totally accurate by today's standards. No matter, it's a cool picture.
The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW
January 7th, 2019 at 2:04:30 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: petroglyph
Quote: AZDuffman
Quote: petroglyph
I thought they were using navigational seconds, minutes, and degrees?

When navigating, there are sixty seconds in a minute, a minute equals a mile, sixty miles in a degree of Latitude . 6000[76]ft. in a nautical mile?


They could be, I am just using simple measurements. I read degree bearings as part of my job. I plot them into plots. I do not do the surveying. For all I know the Four Corners was measured with perches, links, rods, and roods.
I don't know either. They may have used a chain for all I am aware?

I thought they knew where the actual location was when we went and stood in 4 states at once? It was later in the local paper that it was claimed it wasn't totally accurate by today's standards. No matter, it's a cool picture.


Things change. The point where WV meets PA and OH is one of the most special borders in the USA for it is where all the surveying for the western reserve begins. You have a house in the Midwest? Well, the survey is based from this point. Except the “marked” point isn’t the real point as the real point is on private land about 30 yards south. I forget exact, but the point is borders are not as exact as we think.
The President is a fink.
January 7th, 2019 at 2:21:37 PM permalink
Ayecarumba
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 89
Posts: 1744
Isn't there an admission fee to visit the monument (which isn't on the actual spot)?

If you knew where it was, could you stand on the "actual" spot for free?
January 7th, 2019 at 2:24:24 PM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 25
Posts: 6227
Quote: AZDuffman
Things change. The point where WV meets PA and OH is one of the most special borders in the USA for it is where all the surveying for the western reserve begins. You have a house in the Midwest? Well, the survey is based from this point. Except the “marked” point isn’t the real point as the real point is on private land about 30 yards south. I forget exact, but the point is borders are not as exact as we think.
All I know for sure is, I bought a half acre from a guy that didn't own it, and I never got my money back.

I got a good deal because I paid cash.
The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW
January 7th, 2019 at 2:25:41 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: AZDuffman

You have a house in the Midwest? .



Why do they survey every time
a property is sold. This 2 acres
has been in my fam for 60 years,
every time property is sold around
it, they survey and results are the
same as last time. What a racket.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
January 7th, 2019 at 2:32:39 PM permalink
kenarman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 14
Posts: 4470
Quote: Evenbob
Why do they survey every time
a property is sold. This 2 acres
has been in my fam for 60 years,
every time property is sold around
it, they survey and results are the
same as last time. What a racket.


If we use the Euclidian geometry axioms a point has no area so nothing could 'touch' it.
"but if you make yourselves sheep, the wolves will eat you." Benjamin Franklin
January 7th, 2019 at 2:47:21 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: kenarman
If we use the Euclidian geometry axioms a point has no area so nothing could 'touch' it.


I have the book of previous owners of
this property going back to the 1860's.
Where there is survey info, it's always
the same. Why would it change. It's
just a scam so the survey companies
can charge to do it again. It should
only be done if there's a dispute.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
January 7th, 2019 at 4:28:51 PM permalink
Wizard
Administrator
Member since: Oct 23, 2012
Threads: 239
Posts: 6095
When I lived in Baltimore I had a row home and it wasn't clear where the border in the backyard was to the neighbors. When I wanted to build a fence, I had to get a surveyor to put out stakes. I heard when a neighbor did the same, the surveyor made a mistake, by just an inch or so, but they had to remove the whole fence to shift it over that inch.
Knowledge is Good -- Emil Faber
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