Will God Survive Science
March 2nd, 2018 at 5:02:38 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
Dialog? Sure. Read this carefully and understand that to an atheist, this makes every bit as much sense as anything your church or the Baptists believe about Jesus. Moonies deny the deity of Jesus Christ; instead they claim He was just a man, not God. ("God is just like you and me. All human traits originate in God." -- Moon, Christianity in Crisis, p. 4; and "He can by no means be God Himself." -- Divine Principle, pp. 210-211). They teach that Jesus was not virgin born, but was the bastard offspring of Zechariah and Mary! They also claim that Jesus failed in His earthly mission (Divine Principle, pp. 143-145), and that Christ's purpose in coming was to marry and to produce perfect children. However, He was killed before He could fulfill His mission (i.e., "The Cross is the symbol of defeat of Christianity," Moon, 1973). Moonies believe that John the Baptist was responsible for the death of Jesus (by failing to convert his audience into a power bloc for Jesus) (Divine Principle, pp. 156-162), and that Christ's death on the cross was not an original or essential part of God's plan of redemption ("... however devout a man of faith may be, he cannot fulfill physical salvation by redemption through Jesus crucifixion alone." -- Divine Principle, p. 148), but that God merely used it to provide an incomplete, spiritual salvation. They do not believe that Jesus was physically resurrected (cf. 1 Cor. 15:12-20), but that He returned as a spirit, and that a "third Adam" must come to fulfill God's plan for physical salvation by marrying and producing the sinless race. The Unification Church has given titles to Moon that indicate it considers him to be this "third Adam." In fact it makes MORE sense because Jesus was not divine, not virgin born, didn't die to save anybody, wasn't physically resurrected. Atheists don't have a god, so this is just another version of the myth. Another cult, another story. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
March 2nd, 2018 at 7:20:33 PM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 | Okay let's start with clarifying the question we are discussing. Are we going to dialogue about the question: is Catholicism a cult? Or would you like to propose a different question; you brought up a lot of misunderstandings recently so we could talk about if Catholics worship idols, if the Pope is the sole head of the Church, the Eucharist, is there any non-Biblical text that is equal to or above the Bible, or are there any teachings of the Church contrary to the Bible? Maybe we should focus on if Catholicism is a cult, but you choose. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
March 2nd, 2018 at 8:48:57 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
To me it's a cult, to you it isn't, who cares. I'm much more interested in what Bart Ehrman says about the gospels. How they are not written by eyewitnesses, were all written decades and decades after the events, and were all written in a language that wasn't spoken by the people the gospels were about, by men who lived nowhere near that area. At least half the books in the NT are outright forgeries, written by god knows who or for what reason. So you have 4 gospels that say contradictory things, were not written by anybody who was there or even knew anybody who was there. What people have done since the NT came out, is take all 4 gospels, smash them together, and make their own gospel out of the mess. This is why there are so many brands of Xtionity. This is why the Moonie version is just as valid as any other version to an outsider. Nobody can know what really happened, if anything, from the sketchy and contradictory 4 gospels, so y'all make up your own versions and put the stamp of authenticity on it and claim it's the only true version. To an atheist outsider it's all pure deluded insanity. It all has to be dismissed as unproveable and useless ramblings. It's followers have to be viewed as having a few screws loose to believe any of it. Like I said, at least the Moonies were smart enough to erase most of the supernatural claptrap from their version to bring it out of the supernatural dark ages and make it more modern. Kudos to them for that, at least. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
March 2nd, 2018 at 9:06:04 PM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 | Okay so the question is are the Gospels reliable? “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
March 2nd, 2018 at 10:47:59 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
Why do you think Ehrman went from a rabid believer to an agnostic/atheist when he discovered the truth about what the NT really is. When he uncovered it's mostly fantasy, mostly invented stories to bolster a myth. It destroyed his faith, just like it destroyed Joseph Campbell's. The truth will do that to you. Real truth, not Vatican truth. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
March 3rd, 2018 at 11:07:48 AM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 | New thread started. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |