Science and God

Quote: FrGamble

You are correct, sorry about that and thanks again for being so kind.

You're welcome.

Quote: FrGamble

You might say that many more very smart people do want to believe in God and so they will go to great lengths to believe in Him, and you would be correct.

Did you see a rather underrated movie called "The Truman Show"? At one point the villain explains children tend to accept the world as presented to them without question.

Belief in a deity, or several, goes back to long before human civilization. Literally hundreds of billions of children were presented growing up with a world that contains supernatural entities. Not only deities, but demons, fairies, ghosts, etc, etc. And along with all these, there was magic as well. That's the kind of world 99% of human beings were taught as children, and which they taught their children.

Magic is not as ubiquitous as it used to be, but it's still there, even in advanced, industrialized countries (think how many people visit psychics and other such charlatans). Its influence, the belief in it, has waned. Imagine going to the doctor for a broken arm. If your doctor said an incantation before setting your arm, you'd think about going to a different doctor. In ancient times incantations were an integral part of medicine.

The point is most people believe in a god simply because as children they were presented with such a type of world. To many of them, saying there is a god is like saying the sky is blue: it's not even a point worth making. It's also easier, for many, to keep a comfortable belief than it is to question it, in particular if this god seems to have little influence, if any, in their daily lives.

As the influence of religion wanes, through various means stretching back to the Reformation, you can see belief in Jesus today is not the same as it was in the XIX Century, much less in the Middle Ages.

Quote: Nareed

To many of them, saying there is a god is like saying the sky is blue: it's not even a point worth making.

Every person I know who believes in
god is that way. It's how they were
raised, they have given it zero thought
and never will. With atheism, you actually
have to arrive at it by careful study. Belief
in god was arrived at for you, no work
involved at all.

Quote: FrGamble

Just please stop saying there is no evidence, reasons, or facts that would lead one to make a rational decision to believe in God.

There is evidence, there are reasons, there are facts that could lead one to a rational decision to believe in God.

However, there is no proof.

There are alternate explanations.

There are multiple ways to interpret the facts.

There are many reasons that could lead one to a rational decision to not believe in God.

Quote: Dalex64

There is evidence, there are reasons, there are facts that could lead one to a rational decision to believe in God.
.

Like what, name some. I've never
seen even one fact or one piece
of evidence that points to a god.

If you Google it, there is 'evidence'
of god all over the place. Until you
actually read them and realize god
is on the list of possibilities, that's
all. That is hardly evidence of gods
existence.

That is exactly what I am saying, Bob. There is evidence, and God is but one of the ideas supported by that evidence.

There are other plausible explainations for things, but for the ones in which we have not proven the explainations to be true, in the absense of any evidence to refute it, God remains on the list of possible explainations.

Quote: Dalex64

God remains on the list of possible explainations.

I believe unicorns created the universe.
That has as much substance as a god
that did it. There is NO evidence that
points to god. None. And with such a
huge issue, (not to me, but to some)
if god did it, the evidence should be
overwhelming. It's not, it's not even
underwhelming. It's nonexistent.

Quote: Dalex64

There are many reasons that could lead one to a rational decision to not believe in God.

Dalex, thanks for being so rational and fair in your responses. I agree with most of what you are saying, except the above. I'm wondering what would be a reason that could lead one to a rational decision to not believe in God?

Quote: FrGamble

I'm wondering what would be a reason that could lead one to a rational decision to not believe in God?

HUH???? You have yet to provide one piece
of real evidence that points to gods existence.
Without REAL evidence, the only rational
decision is that god doesn't exist. And please
don't say the big bang again, it's a theory and
as such, is proof of nothing. Let's not go down
that road again, even the experts can't agree
on it.

Quote: FrGamble

Dalex, thanks for being so rational and fair in your responses. I agree with most of what you are saying, except the above. I'm wondering what would be a reason that could lead one to a rational decision to not believe in God?

There are many. I will probably be repeating things that I or others have probably already said.

Gods and religions were created to explain the unexplainable, and bring rules, law, and order to often anarchic societies.

Through our long history, we have discovered the answers to many of our questions, and previously unexplainable phenomena are no longer attributed to God or gods.

Stephen Hawking once said something like "God isn't needed" or isn't necessary. It sums up a rational train of thought - as more and more mysteries of life are understood and taken from the gods, what is left with the gods?

Another argument, and this one is personal to me and I have no idea how many people in he world agree with me is:
There have been many gods and many religions throughout the course of human history. What makes any of them right?
There are so many disparate beliefs in the world right now. They can't all be right.
Each one supplants the last, and competes with eachother. At the time, they thought they were right. But time and time again they are replaced with others who claim that those people were wrong, and THIS NOW really is right. What if the right one has already come and gone?

It is much easier to reason that they all are wrong, and continue to be wrong.

We don't have to have all of the answers now, and I think it is extremely prideful to think that we do have the answers.