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Quote: petroglyph

There are already laws in place that make it illegal to discriminate against workers over 40. Try making a living in construction when you have to find multiple employers without some kind of hiring hall.

I know there are examples of old bent over guys out trowling concrete, but it is no secret out in the tools that old guys are undesirable.

As someone that has been in construction for almost 50 years and the majority of those years as an employer I never found old guys as undesirable. You always needed a mix of experience but in economic downturn you always protected the old guys since they had the knowledge. If you look at the registration in apprenticeship schools it starts plummeting after the first year of a down turn because all the young guys are let go.

Even now when I am past retirement age I still am turning down job offers.

Quote: kenarman

As someone that has been in construction for almost 50 years and the majority of those years as an employer I never found old guys as undesirable. You always needed a mix of experience but in economic downturn you always protected the old guys since they had the knowledge. If you look at the registration in apprenticeship schools it starts plummeting after the first year of a down turn because all the young guys are let go.

Even now when I am past retirement age I still am turning down job offers.

I have always admired Canadians perspective. I think generally they are kinder, gentler, and have more moral character on average than us Americans.

But also in your thought process, include state sponsored health care. Of course there are exclusions to my statement about the undesirability of older workers, and it really gets noticeable after 50. At least that is what I witnessed down here in this concrete jungle.

As you say, you wanted to keep your more experienced workers and that IMO is wise. But for new hires, most don't consider the old guys that are more apt to be hiding some medical deformity. They don't have the accidents that the young racers do, due to experience, but physical damage is accumulative. A lot of older experienced guys are cloaking blown discs, bad knees, etc. We are more of a liability.

The last few years, I had to take physicals [still do for my cdl], that included an xray. I have had more than one doctor see my xray and ask "doesn't that hurt"? If I wasn't willing to lie about pain, I couldn't get a job. That is where I really learned that, unless you tell a doctor what is wrong, they can't find it. Lot of guys out there working with blown discs, they are ticking time bombs. As Jack Webb used to say, "Just the facts". I worked over twenty years with bulging and or pinched discs. In short duration, I could keep up with near anybody, but in a dead heat marathon long haul, something would bust. Just sayin

My wife claims, "Humpty Dumpty was pushed". : ), I think he had a pre-existing injury.

Quote: DRich

I have never been in a union and don't unserstand the details of their memberships but when you know many "construction workers" making over a $100k a year it make me question the system.

Depends on the construction work and skill needed. Laborer no way. Guy welding gas lines with his own equipment totally. What you have to remember is hiring hall work can be cyclical. When several casino-hotels were being built mid-1950s then 50 years later in mid-2000s on the strip demand was sky-high. Jay Sarno and Steve Wynn might have paid extra to get done faster and keep tradesmen off other jobs. When it crashed in 2008 wage collapsed.

Yes petroglyph the pre-existing conditions can be a very serious concern when hiring. Worker Compensation rates can go through the roof if a company gets caught on a few. Some companies are made so uncompetitive by their WCB rates that they have to shut down and open with new principals to get around them. The most dangerous trade in Canada is roofing and a new company with no history that has a serious accident can end up paying an additional 50% to WCB based on the their total wage payments to all workers.

Young guys get hurt more and that is an issue as well. It takes old guys to keep them safe.

Although we have lots of people gaming the system I think it is less in Canada than in the US but it is certainly on the up swing here.

Quote: petroglyph

Well gee, what do you think would be a fair wage for them?

Do those that use your services get to negotiate what they will pay?

Yes, I believe all prices are negotiable in a free market economy. Fair wages are whatever someone is willing to pay and I do believe the union workers are being paid fairly. What I don't believe in is that unions should get get federal and state protection

My point was that there is a common misconception that all union members are being repressed by their employers. Clearly Las Vegas is different than other places and I highly recommend that someone wanting to be paid well for construction work move to Las Vegas. I even know a foreman that will hire just about anybody that kicks him back 20% of their pay.

Quote: AZDuffman

Depends on the construction work and skill needed. Laborer no way. Guy welding gas lines with his own equipment totally. What you have to remember is hiring hall work can be cyclical. When several casino-hotels were being built mid-1950s then 50 years later in mid-2000s on the strip demand was sky-high. Jay Sarno and Steve Wynn might have paid extra to get done faster and keep tradesmen off other jobs. When it crashed in 2008 wage collapsed.

One of my best friends is a laborer for the carpenters union in Vegas. His job consists mainly of laying out forms for concrete pours for buildings. He works a lot and makes in the $100k range. Clearly that isn't typical everywhere, but those jobs do exist in Vegas.

You bring up a great point. When business is good in Las Vegas it is great, other times terrible. Construction workers made HUGE money building CityCenter 2007 to 2009 and then the economy tanked and those not willing to relocate didn't work for a year or two.

Quote: DRich

You bring up a great point. When business is good in Las Vegas it is great, other times terrible. Construction workers made HUGE money building CityCenter 2007 to 2009 and then the economy tanked and those not willing to relocate didn't work for a year or two.

In 2012 I got a trainee driver in the shuttle back to the airport. He was chatting with his supervisor, and told her he used to drive cement mixers but those jobs had been cut as construction wound down all over.

Quote: DRich

You bring up a great point. When business is good in Las Vegas it is great, other times terrible. Construction workers made HUGE money building CityCenter 2007 to 2009 and then the economy tanked and those not willing to relocate didn't work for a year or two.

Landman work is the exact same thing. Chicken or feathers. Flexibility keeps people working.

In the can't make this stuff up category:

Man complains Facebook keeps shutting down his account.

Quote:

“I find it highly irritating the fact that nobody seems to believe me when I say that my full legal name is how you see it,” the 23-year-old man shares on his account, along with a photo of his passport, which shows his complete nomen. “I’ve been accused of using a false and misleading name of which I find very offensive. Is it because I’m Asian? Is it?”


He continues, “Having my fb shut down multiple times and forced to change my name to my ‘real’ name, so just to put it out there. My name. Yours sincerely, Phuc Dat Bich.”

http://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity-style/news/phuc-dat-bich-wants-facebook-to-quit-shutting-down-his-account-w158181

Quote:

The 52-year-old Waffle House server was doing her job and enforcing the no-smoking policy at the restaurant when she was shot by a customer she told to put out a cigarette.

The popular waitress had worked at the restaurant for eight years, and she spent some of the last moments of her life asking customers if they had enjoyed their Thanksgiving holiday.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/waffle-house-worker-shot-telling-customer-not-smoke-article-1.2448687