Simple question?

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April 24th, 2019 at 10:29:13 AM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
Thank God these things are now in the open.


That's what so many of the guilty
say when eventually caught. Of
course they don't really feel that
way, as is evidenced by the Vatican
still trying to do cover-up's anywhere
they can get away with it.

“I am utterly stunned,” she told the Guardian. “The pope has undone the tiny bit of progress that possibly was achieved this week. He was defensive, rationalising that abuse happens in all sectors of society. Ironically and sadly, he exhibited no responsibility, no accountability and no transparency.”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/feb/24/pope-francis-calls-for-all-out-battle-against-abuse-of-children
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
April 24th, 2019 at 12:42:38 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
I think the guilty do feel that way. I think often times the greatest thing that ever happens to criminals are when they get caught. It also is the best thing that can happen to institutions when those who have been abusing others and abusing the system of clericalism and secrecy get ousted. It forces people to really look at the problem and when an institution like the Church has so many of these problems it forces society as a whole to face the ugly truth of child sexual abuse and exposes it for all to see. If you really look at the evidence you will see all that the Vatican and especially your local Church is doing to protect children and root out this evil from the Church and society.

That quote is sad because it comes from someone who doesn't seem to realize that the Church is not being defensive when it owns its own problems while at the same time pointing to a much bigger problem throughout society. Abuse does happen in all sectors of society. The sooner we realize that and implement some of the requirements the Church has implemented in every aspect of society the better.

p.s. I just had a great visit from the Wizard, I can't wait for him to post about it.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
April 24th, 2019 at 1:32:54 PM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: Evenbob
“I am utterly stunned,” she told the Guardian. “The pope has undone the tiny bit of progress that possibly was achieved this week. He was defensive, rationalising that abuse happens in all sectors of society. Ironically and sadly, he exhibited no responsibility, no accountability and no transparency.”


I doubt that she could have been placated by anything the pope said. To expect that the pope would not say that abuse happens all over society is unrealistic. The summit did give a high profile way for people to air some horrific stories.
April 24th, 2019 at 4:28:40 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
It also is the best thing that can happen to institutions when those who have been abusing others.


It's also a day late and a dollar
short. It's easy to be remorseful
once you've been caught, what
choice do you have. True virtuous
behavior is coming clean when
you're not forced too and taking
the lumps.

The Church has always done the
polar opposite of that, they had
to be dragged into the light kicking
and screaming the whole way.
You act like they should be getting some
award for finally addressing a matter,
when they have zero choice.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
April 24th, 2019 at 4:45:45 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
I don't know what you are referring to when you say "always done" this, but regardless instead of you lamenting the Church not having been virtuous in regards to pointing to this horrible problem of society even before we fully understood the scale of its hideousness, maybe we can both be at least a little glad that they are at least finally addressing the matter and hopefully many more institutions will do the same.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
April 24th, 2019 at 8:58:20 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
lamenting the Church not having been virtuous in regards to pointing to this horrible problem of society even before we fully understood the scale


We're not talking about 'society', we're talking
about the clergy of the Church. They preach
virtue, integrity and morality. Any time a
priest was caught defiling a child, he should
be defrocked and turned over to authorities.
That would have been what an honest and
moral organization would have done.

Instead of that, the Church encouraged such
behavior by doing almost nothing at all.
Did you see the Gallup poll posted
here where 37% of Catholics are strongly
thinking of leaving the Church over this
pedophile scandal? They want nothing
to do with such a hypocritical institution.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
April 25th, 2019 at 9:08:39 AM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Evenbob
We're not talking about 'society', we're talking
about the clergy of the Church. They preach
virtue, integrity and morality.


They may preach it, but that doesn't mean they live it!

Quote:
Any time a
priest was caught defiling a child, he should
be defrocked and turned over to authorities.


That is exactly what happens now.


Quote:
Instead of that, the Church encouraged such
behavior by doing almost nothing at all.


This is simply incorrect. These priests were sent for evaluations and examinations. They were sent off to repent and change their ways. All of these things were woefully inadequate as we now realize, but we shouldn't forget that the depth of this problem was not known. Some of these men came back from psychologists as fit for ministry again, "cured" if you will. We now know that this is not how that works, but let's not be too harsh in blaming the Church for something that even the experts in the field were fairly ignorant about.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
April 25th, 2019 at 10:13:15 AM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
They may preach it, but that doesn't mean they live it!


So you admit the clergy of your
Church are mostly frauds? Bout
time.

Quote:
That is exactly what happens now.


BECAUSE THEY WERE FORCED TO!!!!!
You act like they're oh so wonderful
because they were hunted down and
dragged out of the darkness kicking
and screaming. Nobody respects
what they're doing NOW, when they
NOW have no choice.

Quote:
This is simply incorrect. These priests were sent for evaluations and examinations. .


Wow, for committing crimes that would
get them years in prison and a loss
of their profession if they lived in the
real world. Given a slap on the wrist
and sent to another parish where
they could hunt their pray freely. So
harsh, so harsh..
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
April 25th, 2019 at 10:34:03 AM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Evenbob
So you admit the clergy of your
Church are mostly frauds? Bout
time.


No they are mostly wonderful men with loving hearts who desire to serve God and others.



Quote:
BECAUSE THEY WERE FORCED TO!!!!!


Don't forget it is also because our understanding of pedophilia and how to diagnosis and treat those who abuse children has changed. But yes to be credible we had to change and we have, back in 2002. Don't you have any venom left for the rest of society and other organizations that have not changed or are you just focused on the Catholic Church?
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
April 25th, 2019 at 10:47:22 AM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
. But yes to be credible we had to change


So quit bragging about it all the
time, like it was your idea and you
did it of your own accord. You are
so much a part of your Church's
propaganda machine that you don't
even see it most of the time. Or
you do see it and keep doing it
anyway, which is far worse.

37% of Catholics are considering
leaving the Church over the ongoing
pedophile scandal. They aren't fooled
by the Church's 'too little too late'
stance.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.