God and Gay Marriage

Umm...did you say there are "good" reasons why whites discriminate against blacks?!? There are no good reasons for anyone to discriminate against anyone! You like definitions so much you might want to look up this word and see if you really think there are "good" reasons for discriminating. My only hope is that you may be misusing the word. Would you say the NFL is discriminating against girl scouts by not letting them play in the league?

Geez, I put 'good' in quotes to demonstrate
that they are NOT good reasons. There is
NEVER a good reason to discriminate, including
the Churches. Especially the Churches.

}Scare quotes are quotation marks placed around a word or phrase to signal that a term is being used in a nonstandard, ironic, or in another special sense{

My bad.

Quote: FrGamble

My bad.

I can't believe you stand behind the Churches
discrimination against the sexually disabled.
I can't imagine the oppression when the Church
was the only moral authority and imposed it's
notions on the general populace. Because I
believe reincarnation is real, I was probably
there a few times and experienced it first
hand. That's why I'm so appalled now. The
soul has memory, the spirit remembers.

The Episcopal Church of the US has voted to allow same sex weddings in their churches, and their priests (or whatever they're called) to officiate. No one is required to perform them, but those who want to can do so.

Now, since a church has allowed this, and since some officiants will want to take part, is their religious liberty breached if they're prevented from doing so? Do you think if conservatives could outlaw same sex marriage today, their concerns for the religious liberty of this small congregation would hold them back? DO you figure consistency in defense of liberty, religious or not, is a motivation for them?

No one I know of is trying to outlaw the right anyone has to love who they want and to have that love recognized in a religious ceremony and/or a civil ceremony with equality under the law. If a Catholic priest felt for example that he wanted to celebrate the forever loving union of a gay couple he has the freedom to do so, just not as a Catholic priest. He would need to become Episcopalian or some other denomination that allows that, he is free to do so. An interesting question would be if the federal government did not allow same sex unions then would certain religious denominations have the freedom to perform them anyway? I think we would agree the answer is yes.

Quote: FrGamble

No one I know of is trying to outlaw the right anyone has to love who they want and to have that love recognized in a religious ceremony and/or a civil ceremony with equality under the law.

I know plenty. not personally, but people who write editorials and/or are reported in the news. Remember all the bans which included every type of union?

Quote:

An interesting question would be if the federal government did not allow same sex unions then would certain religious denominations have the freedom to perform them anyway? I think we would agree the answer is yes.

I mentioned religious same sex marriages performed before. Usually these were either personal affairs, or done in protest to existing policies.

The point is, conservatives are claiming having anything to do with a same sex marriage, or even a same sex couple, is a breach of their religious freedom. therefore if a church recognizes same sex marriages, doe sit not constitute a breach of their religious freedom is such marriages are not recognized by the state?

Oh, the slippery slope goes titanic with this. Religions can do pretty much everything they want.

Quote: FrGamble

If a Catholic priest felt for example that he wanted to celebrate the forever loving union of a gay couple he has the freedom to do so, just not as a Catholic priest. .

Why bother writing that sentence at all,
it doesn't mean anything. A priest has
the freedom to do so, just not as a priest?

I have the right to do it too, not as a priest.
What does that have to do with canon law.

Quote: Nareed

The point is, conservatives are claiming having anything to do with a same sex marriage, or even a same sex couple, is a breach of their religious freedom.

This is really a straw man argument. No thinking person, conservative or religious, is claiming to have nothing to do with a same sex marriage or a same sex couple. What you seem to be saying is that there are people out there who would not even bake a birthday cake for someone if they found out they were gay or the person whose birthday it is happens to be homosexual. I don't doubt there are people out there like that, but thank God I haven't heard a single person say such awful things.

Quote: FrGamble

What you seem to be saying is that there are people out there who would not even bake a birthday cake for someone if they found out they were gay

They are few and far between. This new change
in society is already being absorbed very well. No
protests, no upswell of disagreement. The latest
poll I saw said 49% of the US is fine with it and
42% is not. The shocking part of the poll is, 26%
of people under 40 say that churches should
be forced to marry Gay couples.

Rush Limbaugh says he thinks plural marriage
will be the law in less than 2 years. And he's
a religious conservative.