Dog Talk

Quote: Face

If you are unwilling or unable, you stay in the kitchen. Pops and fishing buddy Jonny L don't mind, so I've no qualms about the dog.

1) A person understand why. the dog doesn't.

2) I wouldn't let anyone that dirty even look at my kitchen, much less enter it.

Quote: Nareed

1) A person understand why. the dog doesn't.

A dog is like a very small child. It needn't understand, only know and obey.

I think if I perhaps had tile or hardwood floor, I wouldn't mind. But I don't, so I do.

Quote: Face

I think if I perhaps had tile or hardwood floor, I wouldn't mind. But I don't, so I do.

Got rid of every bit of carpet in my house
20 years, best thing I ever did. Much easier
to keep clean, carpet is disgusting. All it
does is catch and hold dirt.

Quote: Face

A dog is like a very small child. It needn't understand, only know and obey.

You're lucky dogs haven't evolved the ability to carry a grudge ;)

Children have.

Quote: Nareed

You're lucky dogs haven't evolved the ability to carry a grudge ;)

Children have.

So have cats, they never forget a perceived wrong

Quote: petroglyph

So have cats, they never forget a perceived wrong

More proof they are the true gods.

Quote: Nareed

You're lucky dogs haven't evolved the ability to carry a grudge ;)

I don't think mine would have if they could.

I certainly don't treat my pets poorly. But while I fancy myself kind and compassionate, I feel it is important to rule over a dog with an iron fist.

While we certainly shouldn't forget their own sense of compassion and loyalty, neither should we forget that they are animals. And I feel that treating them as a grandmother treats a grandchild leads to issues that may end in injury or death.

My cousin has a Rot mix that she lets rule the roost. She treats it like a damn baby. And, unavoidably, it now believes that it does indeed rule the roost. That results in aggressive dominant behavior, which led to it becoming nippy and biting people, including my then-3yr-old son.

To hell with all that. It's a 120lb dog that can do serious damage, and that's my kid who's in danger. I can't control how she treats her dog, but I sure put it in it's place when I'm around. Everytime it started with me, I grabbed it by its neck and stuffed it to the ground. It wasn't in anger or vengeance, but it needed to know I'm top dog, for the safety of me, my kid, and itself.

Now, I have no problem with it, and my kid is now safe. It's still an uncontrollable monster, but not with me or mine. I need only look at it for its head to go down submissively and whatever trouble it's getting into stops immediately.

Know, and obey.

Quote: Face

I certainly don't treat my pets poorly.

Neither do I. But I'd be more cautious about playing practical jokes on my dogs if they were going to get angry and plot revenge.

Quote:

While we certainly shouldn't forget their own sense of compassion and loyalty, neither should we forget that they are animals. And I feel that treating them as a grandmother treats a grandchild leads to issues that may end in injury or death.

All my dogs died of old age.

So there :)

Quote:

My cousin has a Rot mix that she lets rule the roost. She treats it like a damn baby. And, unavoidably, it now believes that it does indeed rule the roost. That results in aggressive dominant behavior, which led to it becoming nippy and biting people, including my then-3yr-old son.

Those are different things. I spoil all my dogs rotten, but don't let them get dominant. it helps I only keep females, who aren't as predisposed to the alpha role. To be sure, poor little Fuzz was rather aggressive and took poorly to jokes (like letting her fly out the door and then not following her out). But she was a Toy Poodle and inherently incapable of harming anyone. I let her chase me around the house sometimes so she'd feel better about herself. When she got really mad, she left the room.

Quote: Face

My cousin has a Rot mix that she lets rule the roost. She treats it like a damn baby. And, unavoidably, it now believes that it does indeed rule the roost. That results in aggressive dominant behavior, which led to it becoming nippy and biting people, including my then-3yr-old son.

To hell with all that. It's a 120lb dog that can do serious damage, and that's my kid who's in danger. I can't control how she treats her dog, but I sure put it in it's place when I'm around. Everytime it started with me, I grabbed it by its neck and stuffed it to the ground. It wasn't in anger or vengeance, but it needed to know I'm top dog, for the safety of me, my kid, and itself.

Now, I have no problem with it, and my kid is now safe. It's still an uncontrollable monster, but not with me or mine. I need only look at it for its head to go down submissively and whatever trouble it's getting into stops immediately.

Know, and obey.

Reminds me of one of the few episodes I saw on dog training. A lady wondered why her (midsize dog) was so aggressive. Every time it went crazy and barked and lunged at people entering the room, she held it close and patted it on the head to calm it. . Regardless of the fact that she was saying things like calm down it's just so and so, the dog found that behavior a reward.

I'm not saying people are dumb sometimes. Okay I am.

However I am in favor of Sea World training in general not negative conditioning. Animal does the action you want, you reward it. It takes more patience, but it certainly works.

OTOH, you can't complain when you work with large animals and you get hurt or killed. The people that pretend they are in complete sync with animals are just crazy too. Animals may lash out, they may act crazy once in awhile. You're always in potential danger with anything of significant weight or jaws. Or if they are poisonous of course.

Quote: Nareed

All my dogs died of old age.

So there :)

I don't doubt it, and I'm glad for it =) But I also remember you saying you've only owned small dogs. There is a bit of a difference. If a small dog becomes aggressive, it's a pain in the ass. If a dog or a big dog does, it is a danger to everything around it. Your small aggro gets loose, someone tosses it in a crate. A big aggro gets loose, a cop shoots it. Small bites a child, you kick it away. Big bites a child, the dog gets put down and you get sued. I neither want my kid injured, a neighbor injured, or the dog itself injured. So while my cousin and my mom don't always enjoy what I do to that damnable Rot, I've no compunction whatsoever.

Quote: rxwine

However I am in favor of Sea World training in general not negative conditioning. Animal does the action you want, you reward it. It takes more patience, but it certainly works.

I absolutely agree, don't get me wrong. When training, positive reinforcement is all there is. You can't beat a dog into compliance.

But this isn't about "physical punishment". It's about dominance. It's a personality adjustment. It's a standard across the board, from owning a dog, raising a child, running a business, or leading a team. How well do children turn out when the parents have lost all authority? How long does a business stay open when its employees disregard the owner's P&P? It's chaos, and a dog is no different. And when it comes to things like dominance, you can't treat your way out of it. Or, if you could, you can't quickly enough to erase the ever present danger within a reasonable amount of time. And that's what a dominant dog is - a danger.