Pope Francis
September 12th, 2018 at 5:18:50 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25125 |
No, you cannot. They always say they do things because god told them to, is leading them in certain directions. If you're a god believer, you think god is guiding the Church, and the men are disobeying what god wants. That's what keeps the Church going, that's where they get their authority. God. When you're an atheist, you see the Church has no authority whatever, it's just greedy men doing what all greedy men do. Sex and power and wealth. But they get away with crimes because supposedly they represent a god. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
September 12th, 2018 at 5:35:54 PM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 | When you are a Christian you realize that all human beings sin, I imagine atheists understand this too. They lie, cheat, are greedy and pursue sex, power, and wealth. Just because someone says they do things because God told them too is a stupid reason to believe them or trust them. God is guiding the Church but human beings fight Him all the time through their sinful behavior. They always lose in the end, but they cause lots and lots of pain and scandal along the way. Look past some of these awful bishops and see the saints of our day found in the laity and young priests and religious who are using this moment to more radically commit themselves to chastity, prayer, and loving service of mankind. These are who God is using to guide the Church now a days. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
September 12th, 2018 at 7:43:03 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25125 |
See? You're doing it too. Everything will be OK because god is guiding the Church. It's what keeps the chumps coming back, they erroneously think a god is in charge there. It's a gimmick, it's the time tested scapegoat. Blame god, put it in gods hands, trust god, give god the credit. But in reality it's just men, god has nothing to do with it. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
September 13th, 2018 at 7:06:31 AM permalink | |
Fleastiff Member since: Oct 27, 2012 Threads: 62 Posts: 7831 | I don't think anyone really believes that God runs the football game or the church or anything else. That cult of polygamists use God as an excuse to marry young girls who have been kept ignorant. I guess priests do the same thing only no marriage are offered to teh young girls. |
September 13th, 2018 at 9:52:30 AM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 |
God has everything to do with it and He is leading and guiding the Church. You need to take a look at Church history and when we have gone through things like this before. When God is ignored and attacked by those within and outside the Church there are always saints that arise who do listen to God and who bring about conversion and root out the sin and evil. The list goes on and on but there was Sts. Peter & Paul, St. Benedict, St. Monica and Augustine as well as Ambrose, St. Teresa and John of the Cross, St. Francis and Claire, St. Thomas Aquinas, St. Catherine, St. Ignatius, plus the countless martyrs and even our modern saints. You are only looking at the leaders who are doing such evil, sinful things and you are convinced God is not around. That is a reasonable assumption on your part. However, if you look at other places in the Church and to other people you will see God at work and calling men and women to radical holiness in response to such evil. I have a spoiler alert for you, God always wins in the end and the saints will be remembered and the sinners forgotten. Love, mercy, truth, and justice win out in the end. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
September 13th, 2018 at 11:34:22 AM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25125 |
God has nothing to do with anything, there is no god. When you realize this, what the Church really is becomes crystal clear, as clear as glass. You see it thru god colored glasses so it's all very confusing to you. To an atheist outsider, there is no confusion whatsoever. Please don't insult me by saying you are never confused, don't force me to bring up times when you obviously were. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
September 13th, 2018 at 12:48:03 PM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 | Oh, I am very confused and angry about sin and evil in the world and in the Church. You also seem confused. How else can you explain an institution like the Catholic Church with all its faults and failures continuing every generation to grow, reform, change, and continue its mission. It is older than every other human institution or country. God clearly has everything to do with it or men would have destroyed it thousands of years ago. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
September 13th, 2018 at 1:10:07 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25125 |
Easily. It clawed it's way to world prominence by crushing all the pagan religions to dust. Then it grew and grew because it was the only game in town and forcifully converted anybody who wasn't part of their club. Then the schism came and you've never recovered. The Church now has a tiny fraction of it's former power, it's a shadow of what it once was, and it's impact on world affairs diminishes daily. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
September 13th, 2018 at 2:23:38 PM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 | Bob, the Church's greatest growth took place as a persecuted minority with no worldly power. It is not interested in worldly power, never has been. It's greatest problems arise through power. If the Church loses worldly power it will be a great blessing to us all. it's spiritual truth is what crushed the failing and false pagan religions. It was never the only game in town and I think you know that if you know world history and the history of religion and philosophy. You may not know that the idea that the Church forcifully converted people is myth, but it is. Even if you are so blinded by your biased view of history you do know enough I believe to realize that forced conversion or forced anything doesn't last for long. The Church which appeals to our intellect and our soul wins people to Christ through beauty, love, service, and truth. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
September 13th, 2018 at 3:03:23 PM permalink | |
petroglyph Member since: Aug 3, 2014 Threads: 25 Posts: 6227 | The only thing changed in a thousand years, is how it is spun. The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW |