Original Sin?

Quote: FrGamble

I agree Nareed in the sense that God was at work long before Christ was born.

Quote: Nareed

You may not realize this, but you're only making it worse.

Quote: rxwine

Most atheist aren't rejecting evidence of a god.

We are just waiting for it.

That's why we end up bringing up unicorns or spaghetti monsters. The standards of evidence we are asked to endorse easily could verify a whole lot of things.

Quote: FrGamble

What evidence are you waiting for?

Quote: aceofspades

At least God gave you a sense of humor padre

Quote: Nareed

I mind this attitude that "if it's good it came from God," particularly troubling.

As I said elsewhere, Christians do seem to think everything that's good comes from God, whether their deity is involved or not. This has all sorts of unpleasant consequences. But the attitude goes further. they seem to think they invented ethics and morality, discounting literally thousands of years of ethical and moral traditions of other, earlier religions and general philosophers.

Like they insist marriage is a "sacrament." It may be in their religion, and I wouldn't dream of objecting. but marriage 1) is a civil and legal matter as well which has nothing to do with religion and 2) marriage existed for thousands of years before Jesus. To claim ownership of it is simply insane. To dictate laws and limit civil rights of entire groups due to that claim, that's just plain cruel.

Quote: FrGamble

I agree Nareed in the sense that God was at work long before Christ was born. Even in religions outside of Judaism one can see the sparks of divine truth all around in ancient religions and philosophers. In my mind it is all preparation for the revelation of Jesus Christ, but even He stands on a strong and proud history of faithful reflections on ethical and moral principles. It's often a sign of antisemitism to fail to acknowledge that Jesus was often rephrasing or repeating teachings from the Hebrew Scriptures.

Quote: aceofspades

Nareed, you do realize I am an atheist, right…?

Quote: Nareed

I do. I didn't think it was funny. I stated one reason why it's not funny.

Seriously, and I apologize if I'm making you uncomfortable, Christianity has too much of a stranglehold on morality and ethics in Western civilization. That's the really big problem. Even now, when Christianity has been tamed enough, it's still too big an impediment to many of us in living our lives.

Quote: aceofspades

I'm not uncomfortable but it appears you cannot even sit by as I good-naturedly take a jab at the padre. It was not meant for you and, if I know the padre at all, he took no umbrage with the fact I was making a joke