An extra $5 million for 500' shorter runway

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June 30th, 2018 at 6:04:59 AM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: Fleastiff
Of course owning a cheap fast prop plane is nothing like owning a jet.


Cirrus had sold 6400 prop planes by 2016 which flew at 211 mph. They developed the very light jet to look and feel as much like a turboprop as you could. It's speed of 345 mph is pretty slow compared to most jets, but obviously faster than their prop planes.

SR20 Number built 1,332 (through 2016)
SR22/T Number built 5,194 through 2016
SR20: US$390,000 (2017)
SR22: US$540,000 (2017)
SR22T: US$640,000 (2017)

Vision SF50 US$1.96 million (2016)

Range:
600 nmi with 1,200 lb payload at max cruise speed of 300 knots
1,200 nmi with 200 lb payload at economy cruise speed of 240 knots

It's about 900 nmi from a private airport in NYC area to West Palm Beach. So I imagine two people without much luggage.


If you own a home in one of these new SkyParks built around a short runway, you could probably taxi the plane right up to your house.
June 30th, 2018 at 8:38:56 AM permalink
Ayecarumba
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 89
Posts: 1744
If you can afford to build a runway at your estate, why not go the full Travolta?
June 30th, 2018 at 8:49:16 AM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: Ayecarumba
If you can afford to build a runway at your estate, why not go the full Travolta?



John Travolta's home is the largest one in a Skypark, but I don't think he has a private runway


There are about 600 Skypark's in the USA dating back to post WWII. This Cirrus $2 million mini jet may make them even more popular. So will flying cars.

Flying Prius
June 30th, 2018 at 11:43:26 AM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
Threads: 62
Posts: 7831
Quote: Pacomartin
There are about 600 Skypark's in the USA dating back to post WWII. This Cirrus $2 million mini jet may make them even more popular. So will flying cars.
Prior to the real estate collapse of quite some time ago, golf communities and flying communities were the two most profitable niche real estate development endeavors.

Shared interests, good store of value, etc

Privacy and security are often concerns, time efficiency is greatest if your airplane hangar is right next to your home.

Areas of concern for flying communities.
Noise
on site Fuel or not. (environment, insurance, etc.)
on site FBO or not. (fly twenty miles for a spark plug?)
Runway expenses.
Aging out: Lose your medical and you might lose your desire to pay for runway levies.
Lighting, paving versus sod, etc.
Inheritance issues: Pilot dies, house goes to non-flying kids and soon half the people living there don't like noisy airplanes.

A wealthy man may want to fly from a city to his getaway home but his wife will have to do the cooking there and his teenage daughter will go right bonkers with no boys around, so sometimes flying communities that are near towns do very well but those in remote hunting and fishing areas fare less well. Often a developer will try to give runway access rights to nearby parcels that are felt to unduly burden the original buyers who now get outvoted

As the internet, fedex, 800 numbers, etc. often make "location" less vital for a business, land becomes more valuable for its lack of development potential. Land bordering national parks or recreation areas can be extremely valuable now. Utilities are less of an issue as solar, batteries and desalination techniques improve.
The "Los Angeles Label Company" moved out of the City of Commerce decades ago but kept its name and its 213 phone number. That number now rings in Montana five minutes from the owner's home and ten minutes from his favorite hunting and fishing area.
July 1st, 2018 at 5:50:34 AM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
This new $2 million Vision Jet which has one pilot and up to six passengers has a range of 690 mi with 1,200 lb payload at max cruise speed of 300 knots or 1,381 miles with 200 lb payload at economy cruise speed of 240 knots. Ranges are shown from an executive airport outside of Paris.

As there are no toilets (except emergency ones), the shorter range restricted to flights of 2 hours or less is more viable. But for a solo pilot flights up to 5 hours long to St Petersburg are possible.



The same ranges are shown from Washington DC
July 1st, 2018 at 7:04:06 AM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
Threads: 62
Posts: 7831
Quote: Pacomartin
As there are no toilets (except emergency ones), the shorter range . . . .
A major design flaw. Executives will want to take wives, girl friends, "nieces" or whatever. Even a solo pilot will need some long haul relief. Women do not enjoy long flights on planes if there are no decent lavatory facilities. Sure it may be a "company plane'' but its a poor bean-counter who does not realize that company executives live in the real world, not a bean counter's world. And the real world includes wives, secretaries, etc. So its not the plane's range, its the bladder range and all too often its the female-bladder range that determines how long a flight will be.
July 1st, 2018 at 7:32:19 AM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: Fleastiff
A major design flaw. Executives will want to take wives, girl friends, "nieces" or whatever. Even a solo pilot will need some long haul relief.


I don't think it was so much a design flaw as strategic decision to create a $2 million jet. Since the company has sold roughly 6000 turbprops over the last two decades, they market this jet almost exclusively as an upgrade to their established customer base. Anyone who chooses to pilot it alone for 5 hours will simply have to use a device. It would seem they even have devices now for women who don't want to sit down on public toilets.



Hondajet has a similar range, but it is much faster and it has a toilet, but it cost $5 million.



My roommate used to work for GEICO, which was famous as being extremely thrifty place employer. I was rather surprised that they had a corporate jet, but they ended up using it to move people the 250 miles between their two major headquarter. They had no toilet (except emergency ones under the seat) so the employees were careful to empty their bladders. The argument was the transfer and wait time for security at a shuttle to LaGuardia, not to mention ground travel, nearly precluded same day operations. The cost saving paid for the jet.


I was surprised that they didn't simply by a prop plane if they were only flying 250 miles, but I suspect the executives want to take the plane away from the adjusters once in a while and use it for them.
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