Home » Lighter Topics » Advice » Men, Score the Joel Lyrics

Men, Score the Joel Lyrics

Page 4 of 5	<	1	2	3	4	5	>

Poll

	can ruin your faith with her casual lies		1 vote (16.66%)
	only reveals what she wants you to see		4 votes (66.66%)
	will ask for the truth but she'll never believe yo		1 vote (16.66%)
	will take what you give her as long as it's free		3 votes (50%)
	never gives out and she never gives in		No votes (0%)
	just changes her mind		4 votes (66.66%)
	can be frequently kind		4 votes (66.66%)
	then suddenly cruel		4 votes (66.66%)
	has earned her degree		3 votes (50%)
	can carelessly cut you and laugh		1 vote (16.66%)

6 members have voted

May 13th, 2018 at 6:37:18 PM permalink
Mosca Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 22 Posts: 730	Quote: Wizard How do you know? It’s implied. The song is about lonely dysfunctional people in a bar at 9pm on a Saturday. One is an unmarried failed novelist, the other a young lifelong sailor. It’s not a documentary, he chose those specific descriptions of the characters and then paired them up.

May 13th, 2018 at 6:54:15 PM permalink

Pacomartin

Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569

Quote: Mosca
And, Allentown is actually a pretty decent mid sized city that did a good job weathering the industrial contraction of the ‘70s and ‘80s.

As long as we are being accurate

Iron and coal And chromium steel And we're waiting here in Allentown
Of course the steel mills were in Bethlehem and not Allentown.

But they've taken all the coal from the ground
There are no coal mines in Allentown

Quote: Allentown

Well we're living here in Allentown
And they're closing all the factories down
Out in Bethlehem they're killing time
Filling out forms
Standing in line

Well our fathers fought the Second World War
Spent their weekends on the Jersey Shore
Met our mothers in the USO
Asked them to dance
Danced with them slow
And we're living here in Allentown

But the restlessness was handed down
And it's getting very hard to stay
Well we're waiting here in Allentown
For the Pennsylvania we never found
For the promises our teachers gave
If we worked hard
If we behaved

So the graduations hang on the wall
But they never really helped us at all
No they never taught us what was real
Iron and coal
And chromium steel
And we're waiting here in Allentown

But they've taken all the coal from the ground
And the union people crawled away
Every child has a pretty good shot
To get at least as far as their old man got
But something happened on the way to that place
They threw an American flag in our place

Well I'm living here in Allentown
And it's hard to keep a good man down
But I won't be giving up today
And we're living here in Allentown

May 13th, 2018 at 7:09:16 PM permalink
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25011	Quote: Wizard Piano Man is not necessarily auto-biographic. While the "Piano Man" may look down at a military career, it doesn't mean BJ does. Song writers don't usually stray from their political beliefs, that's their whole point, to push those beliefs with the lyrics. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.

May 13th, 2018 at 8:29:20 PM permalink

Wizard

Administrator
Member since: Oct 23, 2012
Threads: 239
Posts: 6095

Quote: Mosca
It’s implied. The song is about lonely dysfunctional people in a bar at 9pm on a Saturday. One is an unmarried failed novelist, the other a young lifelong sailor. It’s not a documentary, he chose those specific descriptions of the characters and then paired them up.

Maybe I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed but I don't see how it's implied. If two lonely single men have a conversation, does it mean they're gay?

Knowledge is Good -- Emil Faber

May 13th, 2018 at 10:07:01 PM permalink

FrGamble

Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596

What I'm not getting is why in a song like PM or Downeaster Alexa you all are thinking Billy Joel is being such a snob. He is singing about real life. He's not making fun of them or insulting them or even being superior. Heck, he's in the same bar with them singing on a microphone that smells like a beer. The premise of the song is that the patrons themselves live the song and put bread in his jar. Maybe I'm missing something but why does anyone think he is belittling the people he is singing about?

“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (

May 14th, 2018 at 1:49:15 AM permalink

rxwine

Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 189
Posts: 18762

Quote: FrGamble
What I'm not getting is why in a song like PM or Downeaster Alexa you all are thinking Billy Joel is being such a snob. He is singing about real life. He's not making fun of them or insulting them or even being superior. Heck, he's in the same bar with them singing on a microphone that smells like a beer. The premise of the song is that the patrons themselves live the song and put bread in his jar. Maybe I'm missing something but why does anyone think he is belittling the people he is singing about?

I think I know why he chose Allentown over accuracy.

Well we're living here in Allentown
And they're closing all the factories down

It rhymes and fits the rhythm of the second line. Occam's razor and all.

And I wrote that, before I even looked it up. Swear to God. or whatever you prefer.

Quote:
Joel remembered reading about the decline of the steel industry in the Lehigh Valley, which included the cities of both Bethlehem and Allentown. While the steel industry was based in Bethlehem with none of it in Allentown, Joel titled the song "Allentown" because it sounded better and it was easier to find other words to rhyme with "Allentown."

You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?

May 14th, 2018 at 2:17:24 AM permalink

Pacomartin

Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569

Quote: rxwine
Occam's razor and all.

Well we're living here in Bethlehem
And all we do is cough up phlegm

Well we're living here in Bethlehem
And we wish we were rich like them

Well we're living here in Bethlehem
And the weed has nothing but stem

I did my Master's thesis at Lehigh University in Bethlehem starting in September 1982, and the album was released on November 1982. So it was some speculation back then about the steel mills in Allentown. We pretty much figured out that the choice of rhymes was better.

brown, clown, crown, down, drown, frown, gown, noun

No one could have figured that the blast furnaces would become a tourist attraction. It seems that they did that in Germany which is where they got the idea for Bethlehem.

The 26' by 28' house I grew up in.

May 14th, 2018 at 2:18:44 AM permalink

odiousgambit

Member since: Oct 28, 2012
Threads: 154
Posts: 5105

Quote: Mosca
Then this will make you more angry: he meant it to imply that Davy was gay. “Now Paul is a real estate novelist, who never had time for a wife, and he’s talking to Davy...”

What in the world is a real estate novelist?

Edit: Found it! At least some person replying to the question wrote something that makes sense.

Quote:
A Real Estate novelist writes the property descriptions that go into Real Estate Ads. They have mastered the fine art of getting that maximum amount of information into the smaller number of characters possible.

https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=385399

I'm Still Standing, Yeah, Yeah, Yeah [it's an old guy chant for me]

May 14th, 2018 at 2:31:10 AM permalink

AZDuffman

Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18209

Quote: rxwine
I think I know why he chose Allentown over accuracy.

Well we're living here in Allentown
And they're closing all the factories down

It rhymes and fits the rhythm of the second line. Occam's razor and all.

And I wrote that, before I even looked it up. Swear to God. or whatever you prefer.

At first it was going to be called "Levittown" and more general. It does not matter if the mills or mine were not exactly in the town. The whole area got clobbered and depressed. Pittsburgh was always called the Steel City yet there was a total of one hot mill within the city itself.

The song rang very true to life at the time. All those towns were the same town, it did not matter which you used as the name.

The President is a fink.

May 14th, 2018 at 2:36:41 AM permalink

Pacomartin

Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569

Billy Joel based the characters on real people when he worked in a piano bar called the Executive Room for six months in 1972.

Quote: Wizard
Maybe I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed but I don't see how it's implied. If two lonely single men have a conversation, does it mean they're gay?

The line "Paul is a real estate novelist" is about a real estate broker who was a regular at the bar who always claimed to be working on a book. Joel figured Paul would never finish because he was always in the bar. It's not clear if he was single.

"And he's talkin' with Davy who's still in the Navy and probably will be for life" were inspired by David Heintz. He met Billy Joel in a pub in Spain in 1972 while he was in the Navy. He married while he was in the navy, had three children.

So at least one of them was married with kids, and is unlikely they were gay.

Peter Schiavelli played the first openly gay continuing character on television in 1972 in a show called the corner bar.

Page 4 of 5	<	1	2	3	4	5	>