Raised without Gender

Quote: rxwine

It's not about you.

It does not appear to be about the kids, either.

It is about others--besides the ones purposefully confused--because others have to deal with their confusion.

Quote: RonC

What a stupid idea. People with gender confusion have enough issues; why purposefully add more confused folks?

Everyone gets a trophy...
Everyone is a winner...
Everyone is gender non-specific...

This won't help a damned thing.

To libs, it's all about feeling good, that's
what life is. Doesn't matter if you're not
teaching them how to live in the real
world, what matters is you feeling warm
and fuzzy.

Hell, if I had one of those kids who had an early leanings to conservative politics I would just encourage him or her to be good at that.

Much as I disagree with it.

Quote: Evenbob

To libs, it's all about feeling good, that's
what life is. Doesn't matter if you're not
teaching them how to live in the real
world, what matters is you feeling warm
and fuzzy.

Just saw the suicide rate for those who go under the knife for a sex change is 20Xs normal. Clearly some guidance and not surgery is a better answer.

Quote: AZDuffman

Just saw the suicide rate for those who go under the knife for a sex change is 20Xs normal. Clearly some guidance and not surgery is a better answer.

The people who advocate encouraging those who feel trans-gendered to do the hormone treatment, name change, etc, while teenagers have so much influence because they say it *decreases* suicides. Does it go the other way when there is surgery?

Quote: odiousgambit

The people who advocate encouraging those who feel trans-gendered to do the hormone treatment, name change, etc, while teenagers have so much influence because they say it *decreases* suicides. Does it go the other way when there is surgery?

I tend to doubt it decreases suicides encouraging that, but will leave that point for now.

As to the surgery I think it might. Both in school, an article in a magazine, and by knowing someone who knew someone had it done I have heard the same thing. The person has to accept that nobody they know will accept their choice. Think about this. You lose everybody who is close to you. You must start your life over.

Most people would just pick up and move, WPP style, for a new life. How is this going to work out? Go for a job and they check references. "Yeah, he used to work here. Whadder ya mean 'she?' A guy worked here." Maybe you can get school transcripts fixed for the new name, but your work history is shot. Your credit will be a mess, try getting the bureaus to fix a name change is no easy feat.

So you get to your new life, eventually get a job and place to live with your new credit. You have to live a lie forever, because new friends are not going to accept this anymore than the ones you left. Think about the dating pool, how many guys will date a woman who is really a guy? I would say you lose over 90% right off the top. This is a meme that has popped up on FB for some reason all of the sudden, trannys upset there is no dating pool.

No matter what, your life is going to be extremely lonely. You will be driven to the outside the mainstream since others outside are the ones who by necessity accept anyone. This feeds on itself, you are excluded so you hang around excluded people and the group you hang with makes you more excluded.

So you take all of this and put it on someone who was depressed because they could not accept how they were born in the first place. Easy to see why the rate is so high.


Is it just me, or does it seem there are way more men can't accept being born male and want surgery than women want to be men?

Quote: AZDuffman

Is it just me, or does it seem there are way more men can't accept being born male and want surgery than women want to be men?

I think it is roughly 3:1

The DSM-IV (1994) quotes a prevalence of roughly 1 in 30,000 assigned males and 1 in 100,000 assigned females seek sex reassignment surgery in the USA. The most frequently quoted estimate of prevalence is from the Amsterdam Gender Dysphoria Clinic[32] The data, spanning more than four decades in which the clinic has treated roughly 95% of Dutch transsexuals, gives figures of 1:10,000 assigned males and 1:30,000 assigned females. Though no direct studies on the prevalence of GID have been done, a variety of clinical papers published in the past 20 years provide estimates ranging from 1:7,400 to 1:42,000 in assigned males and 1:30,040 to 1:104,000 in assigned females.



Without being an expert, I would expect there would be more male to female operations than female to male. It is not just the mechanics of the operation, but women in general seem more willing to experiment without the need for final solution.

Quote: Pacomartin

I think it is roughly 3:1

The DSM-IV (1994) quotes a prevalence of roughly 1 in 30,000 assigned males and 1 in 100,000 assigned females seek sex reassignment surgery in the USA. The most frequently quoted estimate of prevalence is from the Amsterdam Gender Dysphoria Clinic[32] The data, spanning more than four decades in which the clinic has treated roughly 95% of Dutch transsexuals, gives figures of 1:10,000 assigned males and 1:30,000 assigned females. Though no direct studies on the prevalence of GID have been done, a variety of clinical papers published in the past 20 years provide estimates ranging from 1:7,400 to 1:42,000 in assigned males and 1:30,040 to 1:104,000 in assigned females.

Thanks for the numbers. 3:1 I will stipulate as "way more." Though if I had to guess I would have made a SWAG of 10:1. I think I have heard of 2 FTM, Chastity Bono and someone who told me about someone.

Quote:

Without being an expert, I would expect there would be more male to female operations than female to male. It is not just the mechanics of the operation, but women in general seem more willing to experiment without the need for final solution.

Less knife work and the hormones seem easier for MTF. Females have to bulk up muscle, men muscle weakens. Demand surely plays into it. It does seem there are more and more places popping up in non-western countries to do the surgery. Way back in junior high we discussed it in some class. Teacher said you had to have years of psyc evaluation before they started cutting. Now it seems more on-demand.

I chalk up the MTF being more common to more guys don't want to act like men. Bad leadership growing up, abused sexually, whatever. A weak man will fall to the low end of the pecking order. OTOH, women who act manly may get looked up to by other women. They get the protector status from other women. They can never get the pleasures a man gets, so why go the rest of the way?

Quote: Pacomartin

It is not just the mechanics of the operation, but women in general seem more willing to experiment without the need for final solution.

For as long as I can remember many heterosexual guys have little problem seeing two women getting it on. (Especially if they can be part of it. Or at least their imagination)

That provides a more accepting atmosphere whereas many seem to hold a double standard when it comes to two men.

Fact is, any group that doesn't feel acceptance is going to have more suicides. Has nothing to do with sexual or gender preference.


Take the recent study showing a big uptick in middle-aged white male suicides. All the reasons pointed to for them are rejection issues.