Gigafactory

Quote: AZDuffman

All of these are just as possible on gas vehicles.

Not the wheels that turn 90 degrees to aid in parking.

I think it is just a question of degree. An individual is much more likely to bump another car in pulling into a parallel parking space than a professional driver. But the professional driver does it dozens of times per day. I am sure that FEDEX gets charges all the time that their vehicles bumped another car. It probably helps if their vehicle is outfitted with every possible device to both control the vehicle and to monitor the situation.

Quote: Pacomartin

Not the wheels that turn 90 degrees to aid in parking.

I think it is just a question of degree. An individual is much more likely to bump another car in pulling into a parallel parking space than a professional driver. But the professional driver does it dozens of times per day. I am sure that FEDEX gets charges all the time that their vehicles bumped another car. It probably helps if their vehicle is outfitted with every possible device to both control the vehicle and to monitor the situation.

I still don't see what electrics have to do with the wheels. And I really do not see the advantage in such wheels what with parallel parking assist that is now available.

FedEx and UPS avoid parallel parking and their drivers are trained to not park where they have to back up. This is done to save time as well as avoid accidents. This is to avoid accident claims, which as you correctly note, are expensive.

Quote: AZDuffman

I still don't see what electrics have to do with the wheels. And I really do not see the advantage in such wheels what with parallel parking assist that is now available.

I thought that one of the major advantage of electric car technology is that motors could be added in wheels, so that cars are inherently all wheel drive, and they provide their own power and torque. As such they would be free to turn more easily in any direction.

Quote: AZDuffman

FedEx and UPS avoid parallel parking and their drivers are trained to not park where they have to back up. This is done to save time as well as avoid accidents. This is to avoid accident claims, which as you correctly note, are expensive.

That would seem fine in the suburbs or in small cities where plenty of parking lots exist. But what about Europe and major US urban areas? How can packages be delivered without backing up?

Quote: Pacomartin

That would seem fine in the suburbs or in small cities where plenty of parking lots exist. But what about Europe and major US urban areas? How can packages be delivered without backing up?

In the USA they either use the loading dock/zone or just double park and run in and out. UPS does not even make left turns. If they take time to parallel park that is time they are not delivering. I can't answer for Europe but figure it to be about the same there.

Quote: Pacomartin

Probably a lot fewer speeding tickets as controllers are much more likely. Also detailed reports on how you drivers drive.

I believe that FEDEX and UPS already have metrics and reporting up the wazoo on their drivers. They will try to find anyway to save 1s per delivery, as it all adds up to them.

That implies they are probably already looking hard at any alternative that provides delivery savings for them.

Quote: kenarman

While gas prices are a lot higher in those markets so are electricity rates 2, 3 or even more than the US rates so the overall saving will be similar or less for the electric vehicles.

Not always. In California the residential rate is 17.05 cents per kilowatt hour. Rates in France and Norway are actually cheaper than that. Sure prices are a bit more in Britain, Sweden, and the Netherlands, but only by a few pennies.

Quote: Pacomartin

First of all I think the $30,000 Tesla with a 200 mile range is just fodder for speeches. I doubt that any of us will ever see one.

Musk has said repeatedly that his production goal for 2020 is 500,000 cars per year. If the price isn't in the $30,000 ballpark, they'll never move 500,000 units; the luxury market just isn't big enough, especially considering all the competition for that profitable segment (BMW, Lexus, Mercedes, etc). Maybe he's lying about selling 500,000 vehicles-- but if that's the case, why spend $5 billion to build the second largest factory in North America?

Or maybe he's not lying about the price, maybe he's lying about the 200 mile range. Perhaps. But if the Model 3 only has 100 or 125 mile range, it will be tough to compete with GM's 200 mile range Bolt EV in 2017.

Quote: reno

Maybe he's lying about selling 500,000 vehicles-- but if that's the case, why spend $5 billion to build the second largest factory in North America?

I don't think "lying" is the correct word. I think those are goals. The Bolt is also aiming for $30K range. Plus the 200 mile range could be under optimal temperature and other circumstances.

In 1989, a Qantas 747-400 flew non-stop from London to Sydney the wrong way, a distance (11,190 miles), in 20 hours and 9 minutes to set a commercial aircraft world distance record. So technically that is the range of a 747-400. But commercially, no one has flown one longer than 8,578 miles.

If I had an EV with a 75 miles range, I would never take it to work unless I was within 25 miles. That way if the electrical connection at work fails, or if you have a home emergency, than you could get home.

Quote: reno

Musk has said repeatedly that his production goal for 2020 is 500,000 cars per year. If the price isn't in the $30,000 ballpark, they'll never move 500,000 units; the luxury market just isn't big enough, especially considering all the competition for that profitable segment (BMW, Lexus, Mercedes, etc). Maybe he's lying about selling 500,000 vehicles-- but if that's the case, why spend $5 billion to build the second largest factory in North America?

Could be to keep the hype going. 500,000 worldwide is 10% more than Volvo sold last year. Musk either thinks he has something coming or is just a modern-day Preston Tucker who sold more hype than cars. With Tesla stock being the story stock that it is, Musk needs a steady flow of good press.

Quote: reno

Not always. In California the residential rate is 17.05 cents per kilowatt hour. Rates in France and Norway are actually cheaper than that. Sure prices are a bit more in Britain, Sweden, and the Netherlands, but only by a few pennies.

Average price in the US 2014 is 12-13 cents per KWH only Serbia is below that. The next 3 lowest countries are more or less the same as the US average.

US Rates